author: [redacted]

subject: Ultimedia Mail/2 bug?

text:
Howdy!  Currently I'm going through hell with the Um Mail/2 included with
the bonus pack.  Problem is:

	1)	Worked GREAT from one month with no probs.

	2)	All of a sudden it won't let me connect to the mail server.

	3)	Reinstalled it all and no go.

	4)	Talked with IBM and my mailbox is ok-dokey.

	5)	All the other apps work fine : Gopher, Webber, ect....

Please, if you have any info reply in this forum as I can't read my email if you send
it that way....  My oh my what great fun.


author: Joe Smeets

subject: Re: Ultimedia Mail/2 bug?

text:
In <3c9091$[email]>, [email] writes:

John:

I've seen this before. In most cases it turned out to be a network configuration problem.
(.i.e One or more servers unavailable) As long as you haven't changed any of the Ultimail
settings in the Mail Cabinet  and have the GA version of the Internet Connection for OS/2
installed it should work.

There's not much to mess up when it comes to the install.

Please contact IBM or Advantis support in your area.

Regards, Joe

___________________________________ o 0 o ____________________________________
Joe Smeets, preferred: [email]          * OS/2 Ambassador &  Team OS/2 *
Compuserve: 70744,3666    IBMMAIL: CABRHP7H,    Internet: [email]     *
Vancouver, BC, Canada.      Phone: (604) 520-3127       Fax: (604) 524-9514         *
___________________________________ (-_-) ____________________________________


subject: Re: Ultimedia Mail/2 bug?

text:
In <3c9091$[email]>, [email] writes:
I am afraid the I experienced the exact same bug.  I also had the problem with
Ultimail unloading itself as soon as I pasted some text to it from EPM (I was
not alone in this bug).

So I have now dismissed Ultimail as a viable mail package - I spend far too
much time looking for why things went wrong.  Does anyone know of a good
mail package that works real well under OS/2.  I am not an advanced Internet
user - so I do like the GUIness of the Bonus Pak.

Thanks.

Doug.


author: Iain Allen

subject: Re: Ultimedia Mail/2 bug?

text:
In article <3c9091$[email]>, [email] wrote:

To get over a similar problem with Ultimail I removed the *.DLL files and
executables in \tcpip\umail.  To do that, you have to boot from another
OS/2 source such as the utility disks because there are DLL's that are open
normally.  The folder is best removed from the desktop too before
reinstalling from the bonus pack.


subject: Re: Ultimedia Mail/2 bug?

text:
In <3c9091$[email]>, [email] writes:

Rob Shook replies:

Have you installed TCP/IP, or changed anything in your path statement? I
had the symptom that everything was fine, except for mail, after I reverted to
an older CONFIG.SYS file that had pointers to my TCP/IP installation. You may
also want to make sure that your passwords for mail and Internet are the
same (just superstition on my part, but couldn't hurt to check) and also you may
want to make sure that the account names are the same. Other than that, I
don't have any ideas. Call the help desk back and tell them you're still not
up and running! Don't hesitate to write to me here (or on CIS: 70714,324) or
to call if you're still not satisfied.

= = = = =
Rob Shook, IBM Personal Software Products, Europe/Middle East/Africa
Internet: [email]         Phone: +44-1256-343672


subject: Re: Ultimedia Mail/2 bug?

text:
In <3c96i4$[email]>, [email] writes:

Rob,

Can you elaborate on this point some more?  The single problem I am having with the IAK is
that when I open Ultimail/2's in-basket, I get the following message:

	In-basket refresh failed!

	Authorization Error
	Bad user id or password

When I checked my settings, I noticed that my mail login id was set to the id I use to connect
to my provider, which is not the same id they set me up to use to access mail (via POP).  So,
I changed the id to the correct one, but I still get the above message.  I also noticed that the
password field was filled in and I could tell from its length that it was the password I use
when logging into my internet provider -- again, not a password to be used with mail.  My
internet provider suggested that I remove the password altogether, since it is not needed.  I
tried this, but still no luck.  Your comment above makes me think it is a known bug/issue/
whatever that with Ultimail/2 the login id's need to be the same.

=============================================================================
Richard S. James Jr.                                                              [email]
Voice: (214) 604-6292      Fax: (214) 604-4348
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Microsoft has not changed any of its plans for Windows.  It is obvious that we will not
 include things like threads and preemptive multitasking in Windows.  By the time we added
 that, you would have OS/2."  -- Bill Gates.
=============================================================================


subject: Re: Ultimedia Mail/2 bug?

text:
In <3cd0uj$[email]>, [email] writes:

I have exactly the same problem. I am yet to talk to my provider (cybergate),
but  suspect that it might be a bug in Ultimail.

Regards,
Jaime


subject: Re: Ultimedia Mail/2 bug?

text:
In <3cd0uj$[email]>, [email] writes:

Try this:
Go to the Mail Cabinet, open settings under cabinet menu. Go to pg 4 of 6
and put your email name and password in the slots for userid and password. Close
everything up and restart UM.

Mike


author: Khawar Ameer Malik

subject: how to autometically put data in one field through other fields

text:
hi,
    i am new to ms access and i have encountered a problem. i want to
generate a pay slip program in which i want to calculate house rent
through basic salary. i have two seperate fields for basic salary and
house rent. i tried to make the default value of house rent field by
calculating its default value as this "basic sal * 30 /100" but this
does'nt work. but this default value option works on forms but forms
are unable to put data in the table so what can i do about it. please
tell.

and one more thing where can i find free ms access ebooks. which
include coverage on programming capabilitie of ms access. please tell
me the addresses of the sites.

thank you.

khawar ameer malik


subject: Re: how to autometically put data in one field through other fields

text:
hello,
       i have tried the form method it worked in the form environment
but some how the form was unable to put data in the table. tell me how
to put the data from the form in to the field of table.

i know forms are used to put data in the tables but my problem is that
when i put a calculation of other fields as default value of some
field it does'nt put in the table. what can i do about it.

and please tell me where can i find ebooks for ms access.

thank you


author: Ravichandran J.V.

text:
Put this

basic sal * 30 /100

in a trigger behind the field.

I have an ebook on Access 2000 which I can email you as a reply to your
email.

with regards,

J.V.Ravichandran

*** Sent via Developersdex http://www.developersdex.com ***
Don't just participate in USENET...get rewarded for it!


author: Peter Russell

text:
You can't reference another field in the same table in any field
definition.

You CAN do this on a form by setting the default value of the textbox.

You should always be using forms, anyway.

Regards

Peter Russell

In article <[email]>,
[email] (Khawar Ameer Malik) wrote:


author: Dean Crabb

text:
Dear Mr Ravichandran,

I would dearly love a copy of this ebook also.  If you can cc: me a copy
that would be greatly appreciated.

Regards,
Dean

*** Sent via Developersdex http://www.developersdex.com ***
Don't just participate in USENET...get rewarded for it!


author: Swifty

subject: Styling plain text

text:
I'll confess up front that I'm using CSS to define the style of an HTML
email shot that I'm sending. It's to employees of my company, and by
manager mandate, so I have carte blanche.

If I want to start my HTML mail with plain text, but don't want to use a
<P> (because the target email system inserts a leading blank line) then
how can I apply a style to the "plain text" before my first <P>? I could
use a SPAN, but I wondered if there were some more elegant way. I don't
want to apply my style to "*" as that might adversely affect the <Hx> tags.

The reason that I have to style the email (and that's also why I'm using
HTML mail) is because SMTP mail appears different from the native mail
mechanism, and I'm trying to get close to the Native format.


author: Mark Hansen

subject: Re: Styling plain text

text:
On 02/24/09 07:40, Swifty wrote:

SMTP is a transfer *protocol*. It is used between SMTP clients/servers and
SMTP servers/clients to transfer mail messages - the content of which may be
formatted as plain text (whatever that is), plain text using HTML mark-up, what
have you. The protocol doesn't imply any appearance of the message content.


author: Matthew

subject: Re: Styling plain text

text:
On Feb 24, 10:40 am, Swifty <[email]> wrote:

A <div/> or <span/> is probably your best bet, because you can contain
the styles you use to that element, and that element alone.

If you're really averse to that direction, probably your best bet at
this point would be to assign the style you want to <body/>, then be
sure to override everything you set in your <p/> style.

Alternatively, you might be able to get away with making a
p.firstparagraph class that sets a margin-top of -1em.

Best of luck!

Matt


author: dorayme

subject: Re: Styling plain text

text:
In article <[email]>,
 Swifty <[email]> wrote:

And why would you want to bother? If it is the *plain look*, then you
must know you can make like plain jane with CSS.

If it is because your colleagues junk HTML emails and you want to fool
them, well... ?


subject: Re: Styling plain text

text:
Matthew wrote:

Thanks for the suggestions. The only reason that I was trying to avoid
<SPAN> is that I'm in an HTML coders minefield. The mail client that we
use has only patchy HTML support, so each tag that I try might turn out
to be useless, as it is ignored by the client. I will soon find out!


subject: Re: Styling plain text

text:
dorayme wrote:

I hesitated to use the words "Plain text" as that has other
connotations. I just want the very first line of my email to be:

Hello, you are invited to rate your manager.

... with no text decoration, and no special formatting.

The problem being that, sent the way that I have to send it, this text
will come out in a different font at a different size from what it would
have, had I just opened an email to them and typed that sentence. I'd
prefer them to match. The mail that I'm sending is official company
business, and the closer it comes to looking like a standard internal
email, the better. It is because Lotus Notes formats SMTP mail
differently from its own internal format; at least, the way it is
configured in our organisation, it does.

I was waiting for this. No, it is because, despite my protestations of
working for a large IT company, I'm just an old phisher, trying to make
my emails really look like they came from your bank. :-)

Perhaps I should have asked my question differently:

I have text in my document, some of which is inside elements such as <P>
and some of which is not inside any HTML elements at all.
Can I apply CSS style to the text which is not inside any elements
without affecting the appearance of the text which *is* inside elements
such as <P>, <H1>, etc.

The problem, as always, it to avoid being asked the question "why would
you want to do that?", and having the thread fly off at an irrelevant
tangent. The answer "I have my reasons" never seems to satisfy such
people. So, I give a little background, if only to satisfy the readers'
curiosity.


subject: Re: Styling plain text

text:
In article <[email]>,
 Swifty <[email]> wrote:

No offence intended, it may be me, but I feel I am trying to catch a
piece of wet soap with hands dripping with oil.

1. There is plain text emails. You type and you send the thing and they
read it *as they have their prefs set*.

2. You make a nice HTML email and they get it if they allow such things
and it looks roughly like you intend.

That's it. There is no third thing that I know. So what do you want
quite out of these two possibilities. Choose one. But don't sort of
hover between them unless you can ride two horses like the member of
Buck Hannassey (Chuck Connors)'s gang who jumped onto the team that was
pulling James McKay (Gregory Peck) and his fiance, Patricia Terrill
(Carroll Baker) in The Big Country.

OK, no more jokes, obviously you will choose the HTML option. Now, this
is what you do, I absolutely guarantee it to to work if none of your
recipients changes their email preferred settings for Plain Text (yes, I
said Plain Text emails):

1. Send a plain text email to everyone on the list, include the sentence
and ask them to make a screen shot of it and return it to you. Bury the
sentence "Hello, you are invited to rate your manager." somewhere in it
with a lot of text so it does not draw attention.

2. Now you know what all of them expect in plain text emails. So you now
can do either of two things:

i. Make a picture of the particular sentence by cropping. If necessary
for each and every one of the recipients, (quite likely the n recipients
will need less than n different pics because some or all of them will
have same prefs) and use that pic in an img element at the start of your
next HTML email to that person or persons. If you are unlucky and your
office is full of very distinct individuals you will need to send n HTML
emails.

ii. Style that first sentence to look like the person's preferred plain
text look. Match the font, the size, the everything. If you are lucky,
you will have less than n number of these to send to n recipients.

Safer and easier is 1. If you do not want to bother them with that first
plain text email, I have a sort of Watergate service I provide, men who
will break into their offices and check out their plain text emails. It
is expensive but I have a good team. I need a deposit. Let me know.


author: Gus Richter

subject: Re: Styling plain text

text:
Swifty wrote:

No you cannot directly as you have found out, since you have nothing to
hang your styling onto.

You can, however, attach the font-family and font-size properties to the
  <body> element if your mail client allows you to access it. In
Thunderbird (your E-Mail Client) for example you can with the EditHtml
addon (extension) by either Inline Styles or with an Embedded Stylesheet
in the <head> section.

You will have to note that (mostly) all elements will inherit those
properties.


author: Bart Lateur

subject: Re: Styling plain text

text:
Swifty wrote:

OT, but what I'd do in this case is look at the source of the mail you
want to copy the style from, and emulate it.


subject: Re: Styling plain text

text:
Swifty wrote:

No you cannot directly as you have found out, since you have nothing to
hang your styling onto.

You can, however, attach the font-family and font-size properties to the
  <body> element if your mail client allows you to access it. In
Thunderbird (your E-Mail Client) for example you can with the EditHtml
addon (extension) by either Inline Styles or with an Embedded Stylesheet
in the <head> section.

Here is the URL for EditHtml:
   <https://nic-nac-project.org/~kaosmos/edithtml-en.html>

You will have to note that (mostly) all elements will inherit those
properties.


subject: Re: Styling plain text

text:
dorayme wrote:

If you send email from one user to another *within a Lotus Notes Domain*
then it is not an SMTP mail, plain-text or HTML. It uses a protocol
called NRP (I think) and is passed in rich text, according to the
formatting rules defines in the Notes Email application.

So, in this environment:
An SMTP plain text email looks like a plain text email
An SMTP HTML email looks mostly (Notes honours only a subset of
HTML/CSS) as the originator intended.
An NRP mail sent from Notes to Notes arrives as the recipients email
application is designed to show NRP mail, and that is nothing like the
SMTP plain text email, at least within my company.

I have to send via SMTP, so if I send plain text mail, recipients will
think it originates outside the company (it does not). So I send HTML
SMTP mail, and I'm trying to copy the look of the NRP mail. And that
involves formatting text that is inside no HTML elements.


subject: Re: Styling plain text

text:
Gus Richter wrote:

This was all I needed, thank you! I was getting confused about applying
"font-size:12px" to the body, and messing up the relative sizes of
headers. Of course, it does no such thing.

At first I thought it wasn't working, then realised that I wasn't
sending a <BODY> tag in my HTML email. Notes needs the <BODY> tag before
it will apply the "body" style.

I don't send any HTML tags to Notes email unless they have an effect
that I can see, and want. This is because Notes support of HTML is
incomplete, and you risk getting odd effects by feeding it something it
doesn't like. Worse, you risk giving yourself apoplexy when you start
changing stuff that Notes ignores, and it makes no difference. :-)


subject: Re: Styling plain text

text:
In article <[email]>,
 Swifty <[email]> wrote:

I better shurrup on this, these complications are beyond my knowledge.
Sorry for yesterday's rave, Swifty... Awfully decent of you, old chap,
not to mention it... <g>


author: Sasha

subject: EMFILE error

text:
I have a FastCGI app on Soalris 10 and after certain time I start
getting EMFILE (errno 24 - "too many file descriptors opened") error.
I open one file on disk using fopen and close it with fclose. I
verified that fclose is called for each file handle opened with fopen.
What can generate such error and how best to diagnose it? what means
"file descriptors' or solaris? Disk file handles, sockets? Is there
way to see from shell what file descriptors are opned by a process?


author: Gordon Burditt

subject: Re: EMFILE error

text:
EMFILE means "too many file descriptors opened" *IN YOUR PROCESS*.
ENFILE means "too many file descriptors opened" system-wide.

So how many files did you (try to) have open simultaneously?

Anything that opens a file or a file descriptor, including open(),
socket(), dup(), etc.

Yes, and yes.  Shared libraries might also occupy a file descriptor,
as might mapped memory.

'lsof' might prove useful.  It's supposed to work on Solaris 9 and 10.


author: Andrew Gabriel

subject: Re: EMFILE error

text:
In article <[email]>,
	[email] (Gordon Burditt) writes:

pfiles is the native Solaris command.


author: Barry Margolin

subject: Re: EMFILE error

text:
In article <[email]>,
 [email] (Gordon Burditt) wrote:

...

Truss would also be useful, you can see all the opens and closes, and
ensure that they match up.


author: Jigar Rasalawala

subject: Uninstallation of application which also runs back end service along with GUI on MacOS X.

text:
Hi guys,

I developed application using Cocoa API objective-C which runs on MacOS X.
I used package maker to install application. How to un-install application ?

As far as I know, package maker doesnot provide way to un-install
application.
If I want to un-install application on MacOS, I can drag application to
trash
and I can uninstall.

my prob is, application has front-end GUI and back end service. I can
un-install
GUI by dragging to trash.. what about back-end service ? How can I
un-install
that ?

Can I use apple script to do that ?

When I drag GUI application to trash, can I catch that event and run
appletscript
which deletes backend service files and folder ?

OR

Any suggestion or hint for un-installation are welcome.

Thank you
Jigar


author: matt neuburg

subject:
Re: Uninstallation of application which also runs back end service
	along with GUI on MacOS X.

text:
In <PF8ca.3796$[email]> Jigar Rasalawala wrote:

Just write a little tiny uninstaller app. Look at how USB Overdrive
implements this. No, you can't magically detect when your front-end app
is being dragged to the trash...! The user has to have the brains to
uninstall your app deliberately. But, believe me, the user will really
appreciate your including an uninstaller. m.


author: Tom Harrington

subject: Re: Uninstallation of application which also runs back end service along with GUI on MacOS X.

text:
In article <[email]>,
 matt neuburg <[email]> wrote:

Not to say, of course, that some won't try just dragging everything to
the trash anyway, and then wondering if it doesn't work properly...


author: [redacted]

subject: FA: Second Sight

text:
Tomorrow I will be listing the following items on ebay:

Second Sight VGA Card
Transwarp GS 12.5MHZ 32K Cache
Ramfast Rev D SCSI card 3.01EZ firmware 1 Meg Cache
CV Ram 8 meg Ram Card (5 meg populated)

If you want to make me an offer before I post it then please email me at [email].
I have an amount that I think they should go for on auction, but if you dont want to loose the chance
of winning these items then send me you offers.


author: Glenn Jones

subject: Re: FA: Second Sight

text:
[email] wrote:
Hi Chris, you would probably get more than $125 for the transwarp but
that's my offer if your interested.

Thanks

Glenn


author: Christopher Ryan

subject: Re: FA: Second Sight

text:
[email] laid this down on his screen :

Thanks for the reply.

-Chris


author: Mike Caster

subject: Modifying Window Title from CONFIG.FPW

text:
I saved a tip from this group a long time ago. It said
that I could change the title of the desktop window by
placing the following line in my CONFIG.FPW.

          title = My Application Name

The tip also said not to use quotes. I just tried this
for the first time and discovered that it does not work.
Am I missing something or is this tip garbage?

Any answers would be appreciated. Thank you.

Mike.


author: Joseph-Paul Wilusz

subject: Re: Modifying Window Title from CONFIG.FPW

text:
In article <36s1ho$[email]>, (Mike Caster) says:

What version of FoxPro are you using?  I used that trick in an app written
and compiled under FoxPro for Windows 2.5b and it worked fine.

JP Wilusz
[email]
All opinions expressed are my own and in no way reflect the opinions of IDA.


author: Roy Deeds

text:
The correct way to change the title or any other attributes of the FoxPro
window is to MODIFY WINDOW SCREEN TITLE "My Application".
This would be done on your first screen in the setup snippet.  I hope
this was of some help to you.  :)

Roy Deeds     Internet: [email]

 On 4 Oct 1994, it was written:


author: David Baker

text:
In article <36s1ho$[email]> (Mike writes:

In FoxProW you can put a line like the following near the start of your
application or main program:

modify window screen title "This is the title" icon file thisicon.ico

That will give you a name for the main screen as well as the name for the icon
when you minimise FoxPro. You can also have your own icon if you have an
appropriate .ICO file.

Sorry I don't know whether you can do the same from CONFIG.FPW

Dave


subject: Next Page Shortcut

text:
Novice here.  This is not an authoring question per se, but one for
which your knowledge may be pertinent...

Does anyone know of a shortcut I could use with IE to
move forward to the designated "next page".  I am pretty sure that
the "next page" is more than a simple link because I heard it gets pre-
loaded with some browsers.  If I could simply access the next page with
a keystroke or a mouse macro, I could save miles of mousing.  This
would make for one great doohickey.

I heard of something called XLink which as I understand it will make
links much more dynamic and have access to universal
functions like "next page" but I don't think anyone has implemented it
yet.  Sounds cool though.

If you could even just recommend a forum where someone might help me
with this I would appreciate it.

Thanks,

B in Brooklyn

Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com/


author: David Dorward

subject: Re: Next Page Shortcut

text:
[email] wrote:

Just link: Next

It isn't. A couple of years ago look ahead caching programs were popular.
These scaned a page for links and started downloading everything so that
when any link was clicked it would already be in the cache.


author: Etan Wexler

subject: Re: Next Page Shortcut

text:
In article <91ehg0$2v$[email]>, <[email]>
wrote:

I do not know that Internet Explorer makes use of what I am about to
explain.

You can set the 'rel' attribute of 'link' elements and of 'a' elements.
If the value of 'rel' contains the keyword 'next', the link is
designated as a link to the next resource in an ordered group of
resources.

XLink (the XML Linking Language [which further expanded is the
Extensible Markup Language Linking Language]) certainly has more
features than have HTML links.  To my knowledge, XLink has been the
subject of partial implementations.  Bear in mind that the XLink
specification is not yet finalized.  You can get more information at
<http://www.w3.org/XML/Linking>.


author: Tim Larson

subject: Re: Next Page Shortcut

text:
If implemented, the LINK element could be used to do what you have
described.  There is also an attribute called "accesskey" that could, if
implemented, do "key macro" type navigation.

Unfortunately, no mainstream browser implements these useful
accessibility features.  The closest I've seen is iCab.

Tim


subject: Re: Next Page Shortcut

text:
David,  could you please clarify

I assume you are suggesting a macro which will activate the current
next page link.  How would I do that? HTML novice here.

Thanks

B in Brooklyn

In article <91f9de$sc9$[email]>,
  David Dorward <[email]> wrote:
pre-
with
popular.
that

Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com/


author: Thomas Dowling

subject: Re: Next Page Shortcut

text:
"Tim Larson" <[email]> wrote in message
news:[email]...

IE, at least on the Windows side, has implemented accesskey since 4.0 or
4.01.  It's also in Mozilla M18+ and Netscape 6.  The problem for developers
is that there's no visual cue built into either of these browsers to
indicate the accesskey for a link, so at best you can manually code some cue
like underlining the appropriate letter...but then some percentage of users
will see the cue without having accesskey support in their browser.

I've heard rumblings that Mozilla 1.0 will have LINK support, which I hope
is true and which I hope gets into a future version of Netscape.


author: Jukka Korpela

subject: Re: Next Page Shortcut

text:
[email] wrote:
[ quotation reorganized by me; please see Usenet quotation etiquette:
http://www.xs4all.nl/%7ewijnands/nnq/nquote.html ]

I'm not David, but I'd say that if you don't know what a link is, you
should study it in some primer on HTML. There are some suggested primers
listed on my page http://www.hut.fi/u/jkorpela/HTML3.2/2.1.html

There are no macros in HTML, and nothing that activates anything, or
"does" anything, for that matter. HTML is just a simple data format -
well, _basically_ simple, with a few complications added later, but
mostly it is not obligatory to use them until you've learned them. :-)

A link is simply a relation between documents (or locations or elements
in documents). It can be _used_ by a browser, as controlled by its user,
in various ways, e.g. to open the linked document in the current window
or in a new window, to save it onto the user's disk, to print it, or
whatever. There's a little more explanation of this at the start of my
"Links Want To Be Links":
http://www.hut.fi/u/jkorpela/www/links.html#intro
There is, in principle, an attribute in HTML for specifying a "shortcut
character" for a link. Unfortunately this accessibility feature has been
mostly left unimplemented or it has been implemented very poorly, in a
manner which may conflict with the basic accessibility features of the
_browser_ itself. See
http://www.hut.fi/u/jkorpela/forms/accesskey.html

For example, you _could_ write
Next
and then some users might be able to follow the link using Alt-N and
Enter, or something like that.

You could also add an element like
<link rel="Next" href="page46.html">
into the HEAD part of the document, and some browsers (but not e.g. IE
currently) would make use of that in some useful way. See
http://www.htmlhelp.com/reference/html40/head/link.html
for information about the LINK element.


subject: Re: Next Page Shortcut

text:
Thomas Dowling wrote:

Really?  Interesting.  iCab denotes the accesskey, but I've had a
difficult time getting it to work.  I never remember which key combo
activates it.

Ditto.  They can finally catch up to iCab.  ;)


author: WB

subject: Dropping procedure - problem

text:
Hi,

I'm trying to drop procedure on DB2 UDB v.8.1 fix 4 / AIX 5.1.

SYSIBM.SYSROUTINES contains row with my procedure and points to not existing
package.

When I try to drop my procedure (drop procedure xxx.xxx) I get "SQL0100W No
row was found for FETCH, UPDATE or DELETE; or the result of a query is an
empty table".

When I try to create procedure I get "SQL0454N The signature provided in the
definition for routine xxx.xxx matches the signature of some other routine
that already exists in the schema or for the type."

Procedure and specific name are the same.

Can anyone help? Thanks Wojtek


author: Serge Rielau

subject: Re: Dropping procedure - problem

text:
Looks like a bug in eth DROP PROCEDURE DDL.
Is the procedure to be dropped very simple?
Can you post it?

Cheers
Serge


author: Database Guy

subject: Re: Dropping procedure - problem

text:
"WB" <[email]> wrote in message news:<c5jp3j$nm8$[email]>...

Unsure, I've not got an SP-compiler to hand, but think this might be
DB2's unfriendly way of telling you that you have overloaded
procedures. Just a hunch (or faint memory).

DG


author: Ian

subject: Re: Dropping procedure - problem

text:
WB wrote:

Have you tried DROP SPECIFIC PROCEDURE?

-----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
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subject: Re: Dropping procedure - problem

text:
Uzytkownik "Serge Rielau" <[email]> napisal w wiadomosci
news:c5k4qr$dph$[email]...

Hi,

Average compilation (bind) time for this procedure is 30 minutes.
In case of communication failure (or by issuing db2 force application
command) package is not created but procedure is registered in system
tables. There are some entries in db2diag.log like:

2004-04-14-00.07.20.680241   Instance:db2inst1   Node:000
PID:29432(db2agent (MPGKB))   TID:1   Appid:GA0A0A73.E80B.008703173815
PSM - SQL Procedure  psm_prep_and_compile Probe:50   Database:MPGKB

DIA0001E An internal error occurred. Report the following error code :
"ZRC=0x8012006D".

PID:29432 TID:1 Node:000 Title: SQLCA
 sqlcaid : SQLCA     sqlcabc: 136   sqlcode: -1131   sqlerrml: 0
 sqlerrmc:
 sqlerrp : SQLRRRCP?
 sqlerrd : (1) 0x80040003      (2) 0x00000003      (3) 0x00000000
           (4) 0x00000000      (5) 0x00000000      (6) 0x00000000
 sqlwarn : (1)      (2)      (3)      (4)        (5)       (6)
           (7)      (8)      (9)      (10)        (11)
 sqlstate: 55032

2004-04-14-00.07.20.758159   Instance:db2inst1   Node:000
PID:29432(db2agent (MPGKB))   TID:1   Appid:GA0A0A73.E80B.008703173815
PSM - SQL Procedure  psm_prep_and_compile Probe:0   Database:MPGKB

DIA0001E An internal error occurred. Report the following error code :
"ZRC=0x8012006D".

PID:29432 TID:1 Node:000 Title: SQL procedure prep_and_compile:

2004-04-14-00.07.20.738401   Instance:db2inst1   Node:000
PID:14782(db2fmp (29432))   TID:1   Appid:none
oper system services  sqloSetFileAccessMode Probe:100

errno:
0x2FF18890 : 0x00000002                                 ....

PID:14782 TID:1 Node:000 Title: Path/Filename
/taransys/db2inst1/sqllib/function/routine/sqlproc/MPGKB/DB2TARAN/tmp/P33251
14.bnd

2004-04-14-00.07.21.582432   Instance:db2inst1   Node:000
PID:14782(db2fmp (29432))   TID:1   Appid:none
routine_infrastructure  sqlerFmpListener Probe:350

DIA0001E An internal error occurred. Report the following error code :
"ZRC=0xFFFFFB95".

I checked a SYSIBM.SYSROUTINES table:

Select ROUTINENAME,  ROUTINESCHEMA,  DEFINER,  SPECIFICNAME,  ROUTINE_ID,
RETURN_TYPE,  IMPLEMENTATION from SYSIBM.SYSROUTINES WHERE ROUTINENAME =
'M_DEL_POZ_OBROTY'

and I got:

ROUTINENAME
ROUTINESCHEMA
DEFINER
SPECIFICNAME
ROUTINE_ID
RETURN_TYPE
IMPLEMENTATION
-----------------------------
M_DEL_POZ_OBROTY
DB2TARAN
DBTARAN1
M_DEL_POZ_OBROTY
66706
-2
P3325114!pgsjmp

And when i checked sysibm.packages  for P3325114 I got no rows.
There are no files in sqllib/function/routine/sqlproc/MPGKB/DB2TARAN with
similar name.
The procedure is complicated. It contains many select statements and calls
to other procedures.

Any ideas?

Wojtek


subject: Re: Dropping procedure - problem

text:
Interesting indeed....
My first gues was that your procedure is pathological in the sense of
not creating a package (because it is so simple).
Obviously that isn't the case.
Digging deeper I learned that a similar PMR is currently being
investigated. Your info sheds some more light on this puppy.
I've two requests:
1. Run a small experiment (I have a suspicion :-):
    a) Make sure you run with autocommit OFF (db2 +c)
    b) do some DDL or DML (e.g. create table)
    c) Create the procedure
    d) Force the app while creating the procedure
    Is the change done in b) still around?
2. Contact support, get a PMR opened.

Cheers
Serge


author: PM (pm3iinc-nospam) CGO (pm3iinc-nospam

subject: Re: Dropping procedure - problem

text:
0x8012006D -2146303891 SQLR_CA_BUILT -902 SQLCA has already been built

PM

"WB" <[email]> a ï¿½crit dans le message de
news:c5m5a1$si8$[email]...
/taransys/db2inst1/sqllib/function/routine/sqlproc/MPGKB/DB2TARAN/tmp/P33251


author: Pasi Hakala

subject: IDL benchmarks - weird!!

text:
Hi!

I've run through 'TIME_TEST2' on various platforms and
I must say I'm a bit surprised/disappointed by the results.
It seems to me that IDL runs much faster in windows-
environment than it runs under unix (linux or MacOS X).
Is this to do with compilers used to compile IDL for
different platforms (say gnu on unix vs. commercial on
windows)?

Results (mean of 5 runs, TIME_TEST2, IDL 6.0):

PII, Redhat 9 (300 MHz)		:	5.69

Apple Powerbook G4, MacOS X 10.3:	4.50
(550 MHz)

AMD Athlon, Redhat 9 (1400 MHz)	:	2.08

AMD Athlon, Redhat 9 (1667 MHz)	:	1.76*

AMD Athlon, Win XP (1667 MHz)	: 	1.16*

Apple G5, 10.3, (1.8 GHz)	:	1.13

*The two 1667MHz Athlons are the same machine booted
into linux and Win XP.

Cheers, Pasi


author: R.G. Stockwell

subject: Re: IDL benchmarks - weird!!

text:
"Pasi Hakala" <[email]> wrote in message news:sjnqc.1805$[email]...

First of all the usual disclaimers, there are a ton of variables that go
into a test like this, other demands on CPU, cache, memory, video, loading dlls, dlms, etc.

Having said that,  I have seen a win2000 machine run faster
than a linux machine with the same code.

There has been some discussion of this before,
google the group for  the thread titled
" Re: AMD CPU - (pentium way faster) "
and
"Re: Sorry Re: which OS is faster for idl? "

Cheers,
bob


author: JD Smith

subject: Re: IDL benchmarks - weird!!

text:
On Tue, 18 May 2004 11:08:15 -0600, R.G. Stockwell wrote:

There is a real need to update my old IDLSpecII benchmarks, which I
see have not made the cut in the new incarnation of my old
institution's web pages (linkers nota bene).  Unfortunately, I no
longer have the time to maintain it.  However, I'd be happy to hand
off what I have and offer advice to any eager new benchmark masters.
I've put an old and not-completely-functional version of the page up
at:

 http://turtle.as.arizona.edu/idlspec/

Ideally, we'd have a modern benchmark which includes separate CPU,
I/O, 2D graphics, and 3D graphics performance tests, uses large enough
data sizes to get beyond I/O and processor cache sizes, and covers the
full range of supported hardware and OS options.  Which, by the way,
is much smaller now than during the circa 1998 original IDLSpec
survey; it's actually nostalgic to look at the list of machines/os's
that entered back then: AIX:ibmr2 IRIX:mipseb MacOS:PowerMac OSF:alpha
Win32:x86 hp-ux:hp_pa linux:alpha linux:x86 sunos:sparc sunos:x86
vms:alpha.

I had collected a small interest group last year, who could probably
be tapped again for input.  If anyone is interested in taking the
reins, please email me.

JD


author: Minh Chiem

subject: What happens when you specify 0 time for the after command

text:
Hi all.

the command I run is
after 0 [list commands]

but what happens is that the event never occur. I would have though that
it would have sent the info straight away.

Also, if I have 2 commands
after 200 [list commands]
after 100 [list commands]

will it run the first line 1st or the second line 1st?

thanks in advance.


author: Bruce Hartweg

subject: Re: What happens when you specify 0 time for the after command

text:
Minh Chiem wrote:

the after command schedules the commands to occur at some later time
(specified by the 1st arg) so a 0 means run as soon as possible, but you
must return to the event loop for them to actually be run (there basically
timer callbacks), so they won't interrupt your currently executing code to
do their thing.
    Your second questions: the lines as written will run in the order given,
but that just schedules the commands to be run, if you get back to the event
loop the 2 callback will be triggered first (as it is the shorter time).

Bruce


text:
Thanks Bruce. If I could trouble more with one further question.

I'm not sure how this return to the event loop works. I would have thought that
once I have the after command execute, then after xxx ms, the command should
execute on its own. How would one return to the event loop? The only way I can
think of is to use vwait but that I don't think that's going to help.

Bruce Hartweg wrote:


author: Cameron Laird

text:
In article <[email]>,
Minh Chiem  <[email]> wrote:
			.
			.
			.
I assume you're in a Tcl, as opposed to Tk, context.
The explanation changes somewhat for the latter.

Does <URL: http://mini.net/tcl/1302.html > leave any
questions about vwait usage?


text:
let's take this code for example

after 5000 [list [puts "hello world"]]
commands ...
commands ...

The intention here was to allow the puts statement to be printed after 5 secs, but
it never comes out. the vwait statement has 2 flaws (well in my scenario atleast).
1) it can't be used here because there is no variable to wait on.
2) it halts any processing until the target variable has changed.

My intention is to perform some actions after a set time while allowing processing
to occur. I'm just a beginner in TCL, but after a few days of trying to scrunge
around to find a way of event driven behaviour, TCL is beginning to drive me nuts.
But that's the same with all languages I guess.

But anyhow, does anyone know how to perform an operation (not necessarily including
variables) after a set time without halting other processes.

Cameron Laird wrote:


author: Phil Ehrens

text:
Minh Chiem wrote:

Because this is the correct syntax:

after 5000 [ list puts "hello world" ]
after 2000 [ list puts foo ]
after 1000 [ list puts bar ]

Which prints:

bar
foo
hello world


text:
I always put brackets in the commands so I can always add more commands
on that line if i needed to.
after xxx [list [command] [command] [etc] ]

I'm no TCL expert, but it would seem that you after command would split
up your puts command into separate little commands, so it would execute

puts
hello
world

are sure about your code? what does anyone else say?
But if anyone knew how to do what Phil was implying, then I'd like to
know what I was doing wrong.

Phil Ehrens wrote:


text:
In article <[email]>,
Minh Chiem  <[email]> wrote:
			.
			.
			.
Phil is a Tcl expert.

His code example gives the result you say you want.

Your code example gives fault reports that don't
seem to be what you want.

I don't understand, "after command would split up
..."  It sounds like some language other than the
Tcl I know.

I strongly urge you to return to the example Phil
offered.  Consider it.  Tell us carefully how it
fails to satisfy your needs.


text:
Cameron Laird wrote:

Ooh, I'm putting that in my resume.  It's not as good
as "lord of Tcl", or "Laird of Tcl", but it's better
than "oh yeah, this is Phil, he's a... uh, a Tcl
programmer... snicker, snicker!"

Anyway, yes, I forgot to mention that the Tcl event loop
is a required item for running my code.  I ALWAYS code
using the event loop (EVERYTHING is a network app!) so
I often forget that not EVERYBODY'S scripts end with
"vwait enter-mainloop".

And I highly recommend Mr. Hobbs very nice Tkcon for noodling
around in Tcl (it uses the event loop):

http://tcl.ActiveState.com/community/hobbs/tcl/script/tkcon/

But that page doesn't seem to point to the latest version,
so until it gets updated, look here:

http://www.ligo.caltech.edu/~pehrens/tkcon.tcl.bz2

And then ask Mr. Hobbs why going to www.hobbs.org puts a pile
of java enabled cruft on your desktop ;^)

Phil


text:
hehehe, do I feel like big nut now!!!
Sorry Phil if you think I ever doubted you.

After running Phil's code, all I got back as the id's produced by after
statements.
Here is a capture

C:\TEMP>type test.tcl
after 5000 [ list puts "hello" ]
after 2000 [ list puts foo ]
after 1000 [ list puts bar ]

C:\TEMP>tclsh83 test.tcl

<nothing happen after 5 minutes so I went to the tcl shell environment>

C:\TEMP>tclsh83
% after 5000 [ list puts "hello" ]
after#0
% after 2000 [ list puts foo ]
after#1
% after 1000 [ list puts bar ]
after#2

<1 min, still no reaction>

% vwait puts
bar
foo
hello

<at this point, we never get out of vwait>

I though that this had something to do with the my tcl compiler but I got
the same result from another compiler. Please ignore my 'split' comment, I
forgot that the list would concat the commands to togther.

Cameron Laird wrote:


author: [redacted]

subject: Nomination for Quote of the Week [Was: Re: What happens when you specify 0 time for the after command

text:
According to Phil Ehrens <-@->:
:Cameron Laird wrote:
:>Phil is a Tcl expert.
:
:Ooh, I'm putting that in my resume.  It's not as good
:as "lord of Tcl", or "Laird of Tcl", but it's better
:than "oh yeah, this is Phil, he's a... uh, a Tcl
:programmer... snicker, snicker!"


author: Jeffrey Hobbs

text:
Phil Ehrens wrote:
	...

The latest is at http://tkcon.sf.net/

Unfortunately I don't own hobbs.org, I just rent a name there
for convenience.  One of these days they'll open enough TLDs
for me to get a good one...


author: Bob Techentin

text:
Minh Chiem wrote:

All this script does is queue up three events for later processing.
Since tclsh doesn't have an event loop, you would need to start one
using the vwait command.  Either use wish instead of tclsh (because wish
has a built-in event loop) or add this to the end of your script, and
you'll see the [puts] commands fire at the appropriate times.

  vwait forever

Unfortunately, your script will never end.  The [vwait] command will
enter the event loop until the specified variable is modified.  The
choice of the variable name "forever" is just a Tcl programming
convention to show that we don't expect this to ever finish.

You could wait on a variable named "untilDone", and then when some part
of your code sets that variable, then the vwait command would finish.
Like this, but note that the first after script gets to finish its work
before the program exits.

  after 5000 [ list set untilDone 1 ; puts "hello" ]
  after 2000 [ list puts foo ]
  after 1000 [ list puts bar ]
  vwait untilDone

If you want to get really fancy, you can write a proc which checks for
outstanding [after] events using [after info].  It would requeue itself
if there are pending events, and exit when there are no pending events.
Note that you have to define the proc and call it once to get it into
the event queue.  Something like this:

  after 5000 [ list puts "hello" ]
  after 2000 [ list puts foo ]
  after 1000 [ list puts bar ]

  proc isItDoneYet { } {
      if {[llength [after info]] == 0} {
          exit
      } else {
          after 1000 {isItDoneYet}
      }
  }
  isItDoneYet
  vwait forever

Tcl's event queue is very powerful and, once you get the hang of it,
fairly straight forward.  You're on to something good here.  Good luck.

Bob


author: Neil Madden

text:
Minh Chiem wrote:

tclsh does not run an event loop by default, so you will need to start
one automatically with vwait.
But this, indeed has the problem that vwait will not return until the
variable is set. There are two solutions to this: (1) Structure all your
code to use the event loop (callbacks, "after idle" stuff etc) or (2)
use wish rather than tclsh, which has an in-built event loop which is
always running, so you don't need [vwait].

There are probably other solutions more experienced people here could
tell you.

<snip>


author: Bryan Oakley

text:
"Minh Chiem" <[email]> wrote in message
news:[email]...

Nothing happened, because you never entered the event loop. After only works
if the event loop is running, and tclsh won't start one unless you ask it
to. Look at the vwait command.

As an exercise, you might want to use wish instead of tclsh to see if you
get a different result.

[similar code removed]

That is because the shell is waiting for a variable named 'puts' to be set.
But notice that as soon as you enter the event loop by nature of calling
vwait,  your after scripts ran. This is expected behavior.

You must remember that, by default, tclsh is not event-driven and therefore
won't process events. You must explicitly start the event loop for that to
happen.


author: Paul Copsey

subject: Re: Corel To Port Their Products To AmigaNG

text:
In <7ee0dp$ga5$[email]>,
	Greg Tallent <[email]> wrote:

The spec is exactly (bar processor) the same as my old desktop. The
processor difference is the laptop has a K6-2/300 instead of a p233mmx.
Disk access is far slower on the laptop, and the only thing that differs
other than the processor is the physical size of the HD (they are the same
capacity and manufacturer too). I've seen the same difference when I had a
2.5" HD in my Amiga.

Paul


author: thalia

subject: my glow is about as bright as I am  - repeat question?

text:
hey all,

know I saw something like this question here before, but I can't seem
to locate it.  I've got a flanged tube that gets welded (in the
animation) to a port opening.  I've figured out how to put a nice
glowing tip to the end of the welder as it follows its path around the
inside, but being INSIDE the port, the glow disappears behind the
flanged tube despite my many and varied attempts at making the flanged
tube turn transparent. I can make it transparent.  That's not the
problem.  I thought the glow would shine through.  The welder does,
but not the lens effect/glow.

Unless I misremember me, the post that talked about this problem
before 'twas dealing with an incandescent candle-flame-shaped light
bulb in a chandelier?  I figure, my problem is much the same.  One of
the solutions, I think, was to use a Ray Traced material for the
flanged tube?  I think I tried that, but still get no glow.

any ideas?  or tell me what I'm doing obliquely?

Mind you, I'm behind the times here.  Only on version 3.1 . . .

may good karma follow you for any and all answers,
thalia


author: philip bruton

subject: Re: my glow is about as bright as I am  - repeat question?

text:
Hi,

have a look at the lens effects through video post and play around with
compositing images/animations to get a desired effect. Compositing the two
images/animations (normal scene and the seperate glow) will give you more
control over the final image/ animation.

Phil b


author: Hrvoje

text:
"philip bruton" <[email]> wrote in message
news:blkb1a$o75$[email]...

Hey Thalia, remember me, the guy who liked you writing :-)....Anyway, it was
me who created that post and discussion group. My problem was corupted file
due to a month of work and saving a 700 000 faces file. I created a clean
scene 5 minutes ago. One box with raytrace transparent material. One sphere
with a glowing material behind it. Now, when that raytrace material was
non-transparent (the word?? :) ) there was no glow. When I made it
transparent just a bit, or alot, the glow was applied. So it actually does
matter if the material is or is not transparent. I don't use video post
though, I use "effects" and have MAX 5, if that matters. If you can, try it
like that, don't know why it doesn't work with video post.


text:
"Hrvoje" <[email]> wrote in message
news:blkcu1$ta7$[email]...
two
more
was
file
sphere
it

Did it!!! Try this, move lens effect in video post below the scene event
(the blue teapot) and it'll work. And cuz it would just add that after, it
actually won't if the object in front is not transparent.
P.S. Nice to hear you again here Thalia :-)


author: Steve

text:
"Hrvoje" <[email]> wrote in message
news:blkd71$u5t$[email]...

Bless you! I've been having a hell of a time getting a VP glow to work and
this little
snippet of info solved my dilemma. Many thanks.


text:
"Steve" <[email]> wrote in message
news:3f9f683e$0$28120$[email]...
it

And many welcomes :-)))


subject: Naughty Naughty

text:
Wkikpedia put up a search for anon authors recently
http://wikiscanner.virgil.gr/

A wee bit of fun to search for 'Solidworks'....

Among the list are massaging posts of the wikipedia entry of
Solidworks as you might expect but there are a few excursions into
other companies products like this one:
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=prev&oldid=84937844

and adding junkycad videos links like these:
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=prev&oldid=113408651
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=prev&oldid=113407761
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=prev&oldid=113407374

the main culprit would seem to be:
http://whois.domaintools.com/12.159.140.0

so long Jim ;o)


subject: Re: Naughty Naughty

text:
On Aug 19, 3:26 pm, [email] wrote:

Absolutely, there is no way SolidWorks should be editing Pro/E or
Autodesk entries and vice versa. SolidWorks shouldn't even be editing
their own entry. The whole point of wiki is to keep the entries driven
by users, not by organizations that are going to manipulate it for
their own benefit (ie sales). Clearly there's a conflict of interest
in those entries and SW should be staying out of it. Naughty naughty
for sure.


author: fcsuper

subject: Re: Naughty Naughty

text:
All,

It don't even see what the big deal is.  I'm a wiki editor myself, and
the source of the changes is meaningless as long as the statements can
be verifiable and are second sourced (if questioned).  Anyone is free
to remove unverified statements at any time.  This is just how wiki
works.  Good man for correcting some of the hype-like statements on
the Inventor site that are more advertising than anything.  Some of
his changes are questionable, but the statements he is replacing are
even more questionable, in my opinion.

On a similar but unrelated note, the SolidWorks wiki article is in
desperate need of some attention by people who actually use the
software.  I would recommend that anyone with the time and will please
go there and make corrections and additions to help expand the article
and make it more useful.

Matt Lorono
http://sw.fcsuper.com
Co-moderator http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/solidworks/


subject: Re: Naughty Naughty

text:
Personally I wish the scum would keep their arrogant noses out of the
wiki.
The wikipedia is for people in general to contribute to not for
companies to assume pseudo ownership of for the purposes of unpaid
advertising and PR space.
This search capability does everyone a favour because it exposes the
audacity, pettiness and stupidity of these people to public
scrutiny.Although I suspect it will just go underground now.
Someone at SW obviously has the job to being guardian and troll on the
CAD wiki's don't they? Until now you might have suspected it to be
true but now we know. Good thing. No more cloak and dagger anon
marketing wank.
Ethics might have died out in N.America but it still exists
elsewhere..
If you read the history of these entries you know it is largely
pointless to make any contributions to them because of the mischievous
and idiotic post/deletion game going on and the rewrites and edits
that remove anything remotely undesirable from the companies
perspective as witnessed by the examples I gave.
I assure you no user is going to post anything reflecting reality
about SW on the wiki and have it remain there.
Forget the wikipedia entry for SW it is just placed and massaged
marketing...and yes I know from experience.


author: zxys

subject: Re: Naughty Naughty

text:
So, the IP or it's link,  it's basically saying these changes point to
some guy or server at SW Corp?

..

On Aug 17, 5:05 pm, [email] wrote:


subject: Re: Naughty Naughty

text:
um yeah from what I can gather Jim Cashman at Concord MA is the whois
(or perhaps someone using his pc ) identified by this as being the
person who made some anon changes to the inventor site among other
wiki contributions.
There about 100 or so posts identified as coming from 'Solidworks'
sources on various wiki topics.
I just picked the obvious CAD ones to browse - try it yourself
I didnt check to see what the reverse situation might be re Autodesk
people at the SW wiki...
No reason why a person cant post to a wiki of course - it just looks
bad if you happen to be traceable to a business.
I guess if you show on the list you were either surfing the net during
work hours or being actively naughty on behalf of the employer -
unofficially of course ;o)


subject: Re: Naughty Naughty

text:
...although he may only be the local SW admin?...hmmm not sure
really...chain seems to end there...amusing though :o)


author: TOP

subject: Re: Naughty Naughty

text:
Cashman runs IT at SW. He probably doesn't have anything to do with
this wikipedia stuff.

TOP


author: Jean-David Beyer

subject: Re: Can't send to @msn.com

text:
Daniel Fabia wrote:
Maybe it is an advantage to be unable to communicate with those guys. ;-)


author: Andrzej Filip

subject: Re: Can't send to @msn.com

text:
Daniel Fabia wrote:

Do you get smtp server greeting message when you telnet SMTP port on
smtp-gw-4.msn.com ?
telnet smtp-gw-4.msn.com 25

You may observe "sendmail for NT" version of problems described in two others
fresh threads. A procedure for relaying messages to MSN via friendly unblocked
site has been also posted.
[MSN does not want to accept connections from hosts on "manual blacklist"]

For smaller sites I recomend sending messages to MSN via your ISP mailserver
(using mailertable). It will leave to  your ISP "pleasure" of talking with MSN
about such problems.


author: Daniel Fabia

subject: Re: Can't send to @msn.com

text:
Apparently, we just use Sendmail for NT for our going as our internal system
is a different platform.

There's no reply on telnet 25 on msn's mailgateway from our mail gateway
server. I tried sending e-mail using a regular pop3 client using our mail
gateway to relay and below is the error message.

Appreciate any help on this.

03/12/03 10:39:52 sendmail(168): INFO:    KAA01976:
from=<[email]>, size=1534, class=0, pri=31534,
nrcpts=1, msgid=<001101c2e8bc$e2b67820$[email]>,
proto=SMTP, relay=danielf-xp.staff.nait.ab.ca [10.0.32.217]

03/12/03 10:39:53 sendmail(1724): INFO:    KAA01976:
to=<[email]>, delay=00:00:01, xdelay=00:00:00, mailer=esmtp,
relay=smtp-gw-4.msn.com. [207.46.181.13], stat=Deferred: Invalid argument

Thanks,

Daniel

"Andrzej Filip" <[email]> wrote in message
news:[email]...
after
retry or
read
others
unblocked
mailserver
MSN


subject: Re: Can't send to @msn.com

text:
Daniel Fabia wrote:

IF
you can telnet port 25 on smtp-gw-4.msn.com (connection is established) but
you get no SMTP greeting and connection is terminated quickly
THEN
most likely MSN blocks your site
(as a few guys reported in the group before you)

Beacause you use sendmail for NT (not unix) I can be sure if the different
error messages are caused by different OS or by different problem.

Have you tried to contact sendmail.com ?
[ AFAIK they SELL sendmail for NT ]


author: Martin Charest

subject: Vertical white fuzzy bar on my Apple 16" screen!!!

text:
Aaarghh!  I just noticed today that there is some white vertical
bar, in the middle of my 16" Apple monitor.  It is pale and blurry,
so I haven't noticed before.  Maybe it's recent, I don't know.

Is anybody out there having the same problem?  Is it "normal" on
an Apple 16" screen?  What can cause this?  Am I obliged to return
the monitor to a repairing shop or what?  >:-(

I find it very annoying and distracting some times.

-Martin.


author: Ivan Boris Alves

subject: Re: Vertical white fuzzy bar on my Apple 16" screen!!!

text:
Martin Charest ([email]) wrote:

: Aaarghh!  I just noticed today that there is some white vertical
: bar, in the middle of my 16" Apple monitor.  It is pale and blurry,
: so I haven't noticed before.  Maybe it's recent, I don't know.

: Is anybody out there having the same problem?  Is it "normal" on
: an Apple 16" screen?  What can cause this?  Am I obliged to return
: the monitor to a repairing shop or what?  >:-(

: I find it very annoying and distracting some times.

I have TWO vertical `bars' (not really bars, but fuzzy areas -no
proper focus) that are bothering on the new 17" Apple
multisync. They seem to appear only at the highest resolution at the
right and left margins of the screen.  I suspect that it is due to
insufficient VRAM (I am running a Q 840AV w/1MB VRAM).  I will see
whether the problem persists once there is more VRAM and if so send it
to the repair shop.


author: Ronald Bruck

text:
In article <2r3d71$[email]> [email] (Ivan Boris Alves) writes:

I know!  You've both got your monitors lying on their sides, and this is
covered by the FAQ!!

--Ron Bruck


author: Tim Smith

text:
Ivan Boris Alves <[email]> wrote:

Try using the centering control, if the monitor has one, to move the image
around, and see if they go away.  You might also play with the size control.
On my Sony 17se, when I run at 1152x870, if the image is too close to the
left of the screen, fuzzy bars develop.  Since the 17" Apple is supposedly
similar to the 17se, this might be what you are seeing on that side.

--Tim Smith


author: Doug Cassidy

subject: Booleans compared to strings

text:
So, this is wierd:

$b = true;
var_dump($b);//boolean true

if(!$b)echo '!$b I wont echo, correctly so
';
if($b)echo '$b I will echo, correctly so
';

if($b == 'false')echo '$b ==  I will echo, which is wrong
';
if($b === 'false')echo '$b ===  I wont echo, which is correct
';

if($b == 'true')echo '$b ==  I will echo, which is kinda correct
';
if($b === 'true')echo '$b ===  I wont echo, which is very correct
';

Yes, I know that 'true' and 'false' are strings, not bool.

this one:
if($b == 'false')echo '$b ==  I will echo, which is wrong
';

I dont see why boolean true is equal to string false in any way.


author: Jerry Stuckle

subject: Re: Booleans compared to strings

text:
On 5/13/2013 8:29 AM, Doug Cassidy wrote:

A string comparison returns false only if the string is NULL, is an
empty string ('') or contains a zero ('0').  All other values (including
'false') are true.

--
==================
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
JDS Computer Training Corp.
[email]
==================


author: Robert Heller

subject: Re: Booleans compared to strings

text:
At Mon, 13 May 2013 05:29:05 -0700 (PDT) Doug Cassidy <[email]> wrote:

Well, duh!

Any non empty value (including a non empty string) is true, therefore "$b ==
'false'" evaluates to true.  Live with it.

PHP is using the *C* convention with respect to booleans. 0 is false, and any
non-zero value is true. A NULL pointer (eg an empty string) is effectively the
same as a numeric value of 0, and is thus false also. Any non-NULL pointer (eg
any object, array, or string) is effectively the same as a non 0 numeric
value, and is thus true.

Why in the world are you comparing booleans to strings?  If this is a
string-based parameter setting, you should be just comparing the strings and
not be using booleans at all.  Or you should not be using string-based
parameter settings for boolean parameters.  Or you need to write a suitable
checking function that does an 'intellegent' type casting that suits the use
case you are handling.  Something like:

function string_to_boolean($string) {
   switch ($string) {
     case 'true':
     case 'yes':
     case '1':
     case 1:
     case true:
         return true;
     case 'false':
     case 'no':
     case '0':
     case 0:
     case false:
         return false;
     default:
         if (empty($string)) {
             return false;
         } else {
             return true;
         }
   }
}

Then:

if ($b == string_to_boolean('false')) echo '$b == string_to_boolean(\'false\')  I wont echo, which is correct<BR>';

Will behave as expected.

--
Robert Heller             -- 978-544-6933 / [email]
Deepwoods Software        -- http://www.deepsoft.com/
()  ascii ribbon campaign -- against html e-mail
/\  www.asciiribbon.org   -- against proprietary attachments


author: Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn

subject: Re: Booleans compared to strings

text:
Doug Cassidy wrote:

“Weird” is a subjective assessment.

It's not a bug, it's a feature.  See
<http://php.net/manual/en/language.types.type-juggling.php> for details.
By contrast to “==” and “!=”, “===” and “!==” do not do type juggling.

PointedEars
--
var bugRiddenCrashPronePieceOfJunk = (
    navigator.userAgent.indexOf('MSIE 5') != -1
    && navigator.userAgent.indexOf('Mac') != -1
)  // Plone, register_function.js:16


subject: Re: Booleans compared to strings

text:
Jerry Stuckle wrote:

The reason for this is type juggling, not “string comparison”.

What you might have meant is how a string value in a type-converting
conditional expression is evaluated (like that of “if ($string)” or
“($string) ? … : …”), where type juggling is performed as well.

PointedEars
--
var bugRiddenCrashPronePieceOfJunk = (
    navigator.userAgent.indexOf('MSIE 5') != -1
    && navigator.userAgent.indexOf('Mac') != -1
)  // Plone, register_function.js:16


subject: Re: Booleans compared to strings

text:
On Monday, May 13, 2013 6:13:11 AM UTC-7, Jerry Stuckle wrote:

got it, thanks


subject: Re: Booleans compared to strings

text:
On Monday, May 13, 2013 6:57:10 AM UTC-7, Robert Heller wrote:

Dealing with mistakenly written legacy code.


author: The Natural Philosopher

subject: Re: Booleans compared to strings

text:
On 13/05/13 16:18, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
even when spelt* correctly

* that is a valid and in many ways more correct version of 'spelled'

Thats the trouble with a loosely typed language that trys to second
guess what you mean. You cant second guess total iditiots. And ometimes
you may fail to correctly guess wise men too.

ISTR the bug i found where two browsers gave entirely different results
in javascript was more or less of the < if ('1' == 1) > variety. One
browser said true, the other said false...and when I looked at the
javsacript spec there seemd to be no casting rule defined for conditionals.

And I had to spend  a day trying to force an explicit cast so the same
code produced the same result in firefox as IE6.

--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc’-ra-cy) – a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers.


author: M. Strobel

subject: Re: Booleans compared to strings

text:
Am 13.05.2013 22:24, schrieb Doug Cassidy:

My favourite link to comparison in PHP is
http://www.php.net/manual/en/types.comparisons.php
where you have also the "if ($x)" results.

Highly recommended.

/Str.


subject: Re: Booleans compared to strings

text:
M. Strobel wrote:

Slighty off, though, because “if” is _not_ a function.

PointedEars
--
Sometimes, what you learn is wrong. If those wrong ideas are close to the
root of the knowledge tree you build on a particular subject, pruning the
bad branches can sometimes cause the whole tree to collapse.
  -- Mike Duffy in cljs, <news:Xns9FB6521286DB8invalidcom@94.75.214.39>


subject: Re: Booleans compared to strings

text:
On 13/05/13 22:22, M. Strobel wrote:

Yuk I do not like  "0" being a representation of FALSE at all.

--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc’-ra-cy) – a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers.


subject: Re: Booleans compared to strings

text:
On 13/05/13 22:46, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
Semantics. It behaves like one, takes two variables and returns a value.

In FORTH its like any other function IIRC, But then everything is a
function , in forth :-)

--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc’-ra-cy) – a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers.


subject: Re: Booleans compared to strings

text:
On 5/13/2013 6:26 PM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Then create your own language.  Or live with what the language defines.

--
==================
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
JDS Computer Training Corp.
[email]
==================


subject: Re: Booleans compared to strings

text:
The Natural Philosopher wrote:

I am not usually reading your postings because of your notorious address
munging and anonymous posting, but really …

What the *heck* are you talking about?  An “if” *statement* does not return
anything (in neither programming language where it is a statement), and it
does not “take two variables”.  It is the *one* “parameter” (for lack of a
better word) to the statement that is evaluated to a value, which is then
converted to boolean, which then determines whether or not the adjacent
statement is executed.

PointedEars
--
Anyone who slaps a 'this page is best viewed with Browser X' label on
a Web page appears to be yearning for the bad old days, before the Web,
when you had very little chance of reading a document written on another
computer, another word processor, or another network. -- Tim Berners-Lee


subject: Re: Booleans compared to strings

text:
On 5/13/2013 6:28 PM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Who cares about forth?  This is a PHP newsgroup.

But then you don't know the difference.

--
==================
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
JDS Computer Training Corp.
[email]
==================


subject: Re: Booleans compared to strings

text:
Am 14.05.2013 00:28, schrieb The Natural Philosopher:

Hmm, in Forth you do 0= or something, then "if" takes a flag off the stack and does a
branch/jump to the else address if the flag is false.

Not easy to see it as a function.

/Str.


subject: Re: Booleans compared to strings

text:
On 14/05/13 20:36, M. Strobel wrote:
try writing the FORTH interpreter...

--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc’-ra-cy) – a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers.


author: Joe Mugnai

subject: G3 wallstreet memory info needed

text:
I am getting a little confused about the several different memory types
available.

Currently, I have a PB G3 Wallstreet (300mhz, 14.1" screen). I have
128MB Ram now (64 original +64 upgrade) and have just ordered a 128MB
Low profile Ram upgrade.

No problem so far.

I also have a 333mhz iMac (Grape) that my kids use. From some things I
have been reading, both this model iMac and the G3 PB seem to use the
same RAM configuaration.

If this is the case, I would obviously like to take the 64MB chip coming
out of the PB and put it in the iMac. Problem is that I cannot find
anywhere that will confirm that the RAM is exactly the same on both.

Anyone know for sure?

--Joe


author: Bill Evans

subject: Re: G3 wallstreet memory info needed

text:
In article <[email]>,
Joe Mugnai <[email]> wrote:

Same memory for iMacs < 350 MHz and G3 PowerBooks.

Go to the memory page of www.smalldog.com and see for yourself.

-Bill (not)


subject: Re: G3 wallstreet memory info needed

text:
In article <[email]>, Bill Evans
<[email]> wrote:

Thanks for the confirmation.


author: Edward Swatschek

subject: Re: SupraFaxModem V.32bis - bogus commands?

text:
That 1640 cps figure is due to error correction, not compression (v42bis
should automatically disable when transfering a compressed file) - error
correction allows ~24% increase in throughput (~1780cps for a 14400
connection).


author: Randy Schnedler

text:
In <[email]>, [email] (Edward Swatschek) writes:

Huh??  Am I missing something here?  How can you say that error correction
increases throughput??  By definition, it only ensures error-free
transfer, not higher throughput.

  --------------------------------------------------------------------
 |         Randy Schnedler                   "Don't call me stupid!"  |
 | [email]          -- A Fish Called Wanda  |
  --------------------------------------------------------------------


author: Kenneth Yarnall

text:
In article <[email]> [email] (Edward Swatschek) writes:

Sorry, I don't believe you.  I see no way error correction could speed up a
transfer to past the "theoretical limit."  I can make transfers faster on a
noisy line as the hardware is faster at detecting bad blocks and requesting
a resend, but this isn't going to give you speed increases, just avoid
unnecessary decreases.

V.42bis compression can make marginal gains on archived files, according to
the documentation I've read.  And it is smart enough to get out of the way
when it can't.

If you know of a way that error correction can speed up a transfer in the
way you describe, I'd love to hear the explanation...


author: Philipp Knirsch

text:
In <[email]> [email] (Randy Schnedler) writes:

OK, this is one of those FAQ`s in the comp.sys.dcom.modems, but i`ll
answer it anyway:

With "normal" modems, and sugesstig you use 8N1, what is nowadays nearly
a standard, your modem sends in reality 10 bits per byte over the line:
1 startbit
8 databits
1 stopbit

When you now use either MNP4 or V.42 error correction, these start- and
stopbits are no longer needed, as the error protokoll makes packages up
to 256 bytes with only databits (that is 8 bit per byte instead of 10) and
then sends a checksum to check, if the package was correct.
Now, theoretical this would give an overhead of over 20%, but these error-
protokolls also need now some command-bytes and also other things slow
the transfer a bit down, but in realit, you will send about 8.5 bits per
byte instead of 10, and this is an increase of about 15%, no matter what
transfer-protokoll you use.
I guess it is better explained in the FAQ of the comp.sys.dcom.modems, but
i hope this explanation is clear enough.

Read ya, Phil


text:
In article <[email]> I snapped:

Well, now -- that is the second time I've done that.  I went and re-read
things a bit more carefully, and would like to apologize to Edward -- he is
quite right.  Error correction protocols strip of the (now unnecessary)
start and stop bits, instead sending an occasional checksum, which does
improve throughput.

It's been a bad week... :-|


author: Stefan Berg

text:
[email] (Kenneth Yarnall) writes:

You`ll love this one! :-)

Error correction really does speed up your transmission, which is due to
the fact, that error correction gets rid of the start and stop bit. There
might be other things involved, but I`m not an expert. Here is a part of
my Supra manual (page 13):

"Error Correction
Unlike data compression, it is usually advantageous to use MNP 2-4 or LAPM
error correction for ANY file transfer, regardless of compression or software
based error correction protocols such as Xmodem, Ymodem, etc. The error
correction protocol strips start and stop bits from each character (improving
throughput) and performs error correction on smaller chunks of data than do
software based error correction protocols (so if an error occurs, less data
has to be retransmitted, taking less time)."

Of course the actualy gain in throughput is not big, but it is a "constant"
gain, not dependant on the type of file you are transmitting.

Stefan


text:
In article <[email]> Stefan Berg <[email]> writes:

Yeah, the sad thing is, it is in my manual, too.  I'm even bright enough to
have figured it out for myself, had I stopped to try. I spent the whole week
popping off without thinking.  I'm usually a better net.citizen than this...


author: John Kheit

subject: Re: Why PostScript Sucks (was Re: GX game graphics...)

text:
"Lawson English" <[email]> wrote:

This is such a silly thing.  GX doesn't let you edit it AS it's
being passed.  All it let's you do is edit something after the
print menu has been selected, but before it is sent a dialog can
be accessed that let's you twiddle with some options.  Big deal.
It's not as if you are modifying the stream being sent to the
printer while it's simultaneously leaving the computer AND entering
the printer.

Heck, Tailor could be made even more impressive...it could be made
to come up right before the stream is sent to the printer allowing
one to completely edit any part of the .ps file; I don't know why
ANYONE would want to do so, but doing that would be relitively
simple to implement.  That, happily for me, is not the current
behaviour.  I like to make my edit's before hand...and for my print
command to simply PRINT, and not be a step to add perwinkle errata
to the document.


author: Steve Klingsporn

subject: Review: Newton MessagePad 110 [brief]

text:
I went and bought a Newton MessagePad 110 this morning.  I'm not going to
say where I bought it because the place I bought it treats customers
poorly, and they don't deserve a free reference.

I'm not going to give any more of an overview than I have in a previous
post because I hate this Duo keyboard of mine, and some things just need
to be seen.

In short, this is quite honestly the best product of any kind I have
ever purchased.  While I am a contractor at Apple in Mac System Software
(not Newton!! I wish!), I have no stake in my praise of this product -
I don't get profit sharing, anything at all.

This is the best product I have ever bought in my life.
Everything you hated or disliked is fixed.

It's amazing, and marketing for it is underplaying it's capabilities.

All of you whiners who are crying about the lack of a free trade-in, you
know what you were getting into when purchasing the first unit, and if
you don't like the fact that Apple at the very least is being *generous*
and offering a *cheap* upgrade, then I don't know what to tell you.

Give your old Newton to someone you care about, and go out and buy the
MessagePad 110 today.  Trust me, you won't be disappointed.

I love it, and some people tell me I don't like much of anything.

Steve, talking for himself and representing only his excitement!


author: Jesse Devine

subject: Re: Review: Newton MessagePad 110 [brief]

text:
In article <2losrs$[email]> Steve Klingsporn, [email]
writes:

Not to mention that the place you are referring to has a policy in place
whereby all clerks must have an IQ under 75 in order to work there....

---------------------------------------------------------------------
| Jesse Devine         | email:     [email] | Versatile.   |
| Mercenary Programmer | AppleLink: DEVINE.J         | Intelligent. |
| Apple Computer, Inc. |                             | Sticky.      |
|-------------------------------------------------------------------|
|       The opinions expressed herein belong to ME, damnit!         |
---------------------------------------------------------------------


author: Kevin Fox

text:
In article <2losrs$[email]>, [email] (Steve Klingsporn)
wrote:

  <major snippage>

Just make sure it's someone with good handwriting or a lot of patience!

Kevin Fox

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
<< Kevin Fox             >>
<< Paladin Sys.          >>
<< [email] >>  My ideas! Mine!
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<


author: Sean O. Luke

text:
Jesse Devine ([email]) wrote:
: In article <2losrs$[email]> Steve Klingsporn, [email]
: writes:
: >I went and bought a Newton MessagePad 110 this morning.  I'm not going to
: >say where I bought it because the place I bought it treats customers
: >poorly, and they don't deserve a free reference.

: Not to mention that the place you are referring to has a policy in place
: whereby all clerks must have an IQ under 75 in order to work there....

Microsoft?

+-------------------------------------------------------------+
| Sean Luke                            milk:-cows.            |
| [email]                (if (cows) 'milk)      |
| if only I spoke for Alpine...        [milk set:[cows val]]; |


author: Heywood Fl

text:
How about letting us know, so we can avoid it in our search for Newts ? (or
just stop by and poke fun at the salespeople).

Heywood


author: William Chang

text:
[email] (Sean O. Luke) writes:

I'd beg to differ. I have a very high opinion of MS's sales and
marketing staff. I mean... how else would any company sell
20 year old software for full retail prices???

;-)

---wc


author: John Eyles

subject: scanning color negatives as slides ?

text:
I downloaded a tutorial from www.computer-darkroom.com,
that describes a "better" way to scan negatives.  Basically
you scan as a postive, with no corrections applied (e.g.
in Vuescan you'd just save a raw file).  Then, in Photoshop,
you invert (creating a cyan masked image) and then use
"Levels" to remove the color cast.

I tried it and it works pretty well.  But frankly I didn't
think it looked any better than scanning as a negative using
Vuescan's profile for the film (Reala).  Which probably
ain't surprising given that scanning negatives is supposed
to be Vuescan's strong point.

Just wanted to share my experience, and curious if anyone else
has tried this and what they thought.

John


author: Kennedy McEwen

subject: Re: scanning color negatives as slides ?

text:
In article <[email]>, karmadon
<[email]> writes
Well, that is an example that pretty much fits the bill.  The scanner
takes 2-3 times as long to scan in negative mode as it does in positive
mode.  At the very least, this means that there is 2-3 times less signal
in the CCD when scanning in positive mode.

Yes - see below.
I should point out that I do not have a Minolta to measure, but I do
have a Nikon CS-4000 and I doubt if the performance of the Minolta is
superior to it.

CCD scanners operate by converting the light incident on each pixel of
the CCD into electrons, which are accumulated and stored at the pixel
site during the exposure and then read out to enable the motor to move
the CCD to the next set of pixels and repeat the process.  The
limitation of all CCD scanners is the amount of electrons which can be
stored at the pixel site.  Typically this is less than 100,000, but you
can work it out if you make some measurements (I posted some
measurements for the Nikon on this forum last week which enable the
figure to be calculated).  Anyway, assuming 100,000e is the limit, then
the maximum theoretical signal to noise ratio that could be achieved
when the CCD is full, is just the square root of 100,000, or about
316:1.  (Note, this isn't the dynamic range or the scanner's Dmax, both
of which can be much larger, and are determined by the noise floor of
the CCD readout, analogue circuits and the A to D conversion process.)
This figure corresponds pretty well with the measurements I made on the
Nikon and posted here last week - so lets assume that your Minolta is at
least as good.

So, whether you scan in 8 bit mode or 16 bit mode makes hardly any
difference in terms of the signal to noise that can be achieved with a
nearly full CCD.  Extending to 16 bits gives you a whole extra half a
bit of SNR.  That happens for a bright area of the negative, which is a
dark part of the real image - just where it is visually easiest to see
the noise.  Note that if your scanner's CCD has significantly less than
100,000e capacity per pixel (and many do) then you are working at much
lower SNRs.

Now, that assumes that you scan the negative AS A NEGATIVE - and permit
the scanner's autoexposure to set itself to be just within the
saturation limit when imaging the lightest parts of the film.  As
already noted, if you scan it as a positive then the total exposure is
around 2-3 times less - almost certainly the reduced exposure being in
the blue and green channels.  Consequently, when scanned as a positive
the blue and/or green CCD channels will only be half to one third of the
full capacity.  The maximum signal to noise achievable from the peak
signal is then reduced by the square root of your exposure saving -
equivalent to around 0.5 to 1 bit of data, based on the figures you gave
in your example.  This is a conservative estimate and assumes a perfect
scanner.  In addition to the reduced SNR from the number of stored
electrons, the noise of the other parts of the system becomes more
significant with the reduced signal, so you could easily end up with a
worse SNR than that predicted.  The result is more noise in the image,
which will show up if you do major manipulations.  The situation is, of
course, even worse if the negative has been underexposed.

So, whether you are scanning in 8 or 16 bits doesn't make a great deal
of difference in this respect - if you use a shorter exposure time then
you are throwing scanner performance away.  Whether that is important to
you is something only you can tell, but I am sure you bought such a good
scanner for some reason!

The only way to improve the image (and get significantly better than
8bits of SNR on the lightest parts of the negative) is to use
multisampling - and the time penalty you will find there is MUCH more
than the time required to do a proper negative exposure over a positive
one.

You need to ask the author of the software why you are having problems
with it, but most people seem to be very happy with it compared to their
native drivers.  I've never seen the benefit over the Nikon software,
but a lot of people prefer it.


author: J. A. Mc.

text:
Since that's basically the process that vuescan uses <G>, it should
look the same.

One addition to the 'photoshop' way, is that after scanning and
inverting, you can use the levels eyedroppers to set the white and
black points exactly for thet neg.

One operation balances -and- removes the cast.

On 29 Aug 2002 14:30:14 -0400, [email] (John Eyles) found these
unused words floating about:


author: Leonard Evens

text:
John Eyles wrote:

For the reasons others have given, I can't imagine this method can do as
good a job as Ed does in Vuescan.


text:
In article <aklp7m$119$[email]>, John Eyles <[email]>
writes
This red herring appears on this news group regularly and one thing you
can be absolutely certain of, the approach certainly isn't "better" than
scanning as a negative in the first place, either in Vuescan or the
scanner's native driver for negative film.

At best it is a technique for achieving a rough scan from a negative on
a scanner which does not support that capability directly.  However,
since the mask removal is being implemented AFTER the data is digitised,
rather than by adjusting the exposure of the relevant channels, noise
and posterisation on those channels will inevitably be worse than on a
scanner which is designed to cope with negatives properly.


author: karmadon

text:
Kennedy,

Thank you for an excellent explanation. It makes perfect sense... and
shame on me for not taking the very basic signal-to-noise ratio
considerations into my line of thinking...

I still have a question about orange mask removal. When the scanner
determines the amount of exposure increase for blue and red channel,
is it a fixed amount, e.g., say, N% for blue, M% for green over the
calculated autoexposure value, or the percentages are defined by
analysing the shift of the "white point" on the scan versus some kind
of a calibrated white point?

Best regards,
Igor


author: Joe Doupnik

text:
In article <[email]>, J. A. Mc. <[email]> writes:

	Yes, the cast, but leaves the rest of the image out of balance.
The various dye layers have slightly different characteristics which
need tending to so that colors match over wide ranges of exposure. That
means the film's characteristics count, and indeed it is obvious when
one uses the wrong kind.
	Joe D.


author: Wayne Fulton

text:
In article <[email]>, [email]
says...

No, it is not the same process.  Vuescan (and most all color negative
scanning software) instead increases the CCD exposure time of the blue
and green channels, around 2x and 3x more exposure than normal, more
than the red channel. This simulates a color filter, like on a camera
lens, or a filter at an enlarger lens exposing the print paper in the
darkroom.  A same-color camera filter lightens the same color after
inversion. The orange film mask is a strong blue-green after inversion,
and the longer exposed blue green channels have higher numerical values
before inversion, thus lower numerical values after inversion, ie, they
are much less blue-green now, about normal data after the orange mask is
filtered out.  The CCD output voltage is digitized by the A/D chip, and
after inversion, the blue green channels simply have a lower range of
data than would be expected from the orange film, which is good, it was
too blue-green to begin with (due to the orange mask after inversion).

The result is still relatively about the same data range as the red
channel, which wasnt too cyan (opposite of red) to begin with, and wasnt
overexposed to compensate.  Specifically, the large advantage is that
the data at the bright 255 end of the blue-green channels are not
clipped by this data shift. The shift occurred at the analog level,
before A/D conversion to a 0..255 range.  Meaning, we still have blue
and green data still present around the bright 255 end of the range, and
the result is more or less the full and normal 0..255 value range in all
channels, ie, normal looking color.

However, if you scan as a positive, and wait until it is digitized to
manipulate it, all you can have to work with is that 0..255 data span.
It is truncated at 255, this boundary is now a permanent limit, there
aint nothing on the other side of it.   Then if you start shifting color
values drastically, all you can do is take away the blue-green, shifting
them towards zero, but leaving large blank areas at the high end. If you
lower it all by say 100 units, you only have 0..155 left, and much blank
space at the top of the histogram (156..255) in the blue and green
channels (and that is not a good thing).  You have no data to push new
values into that blank end. This makes white rather difficult, there are
no high-value greens or blues left anywhere.

This is not to say you cannot shift things around more to come up with
something that looks halfway like normal colors, but such effort does
not come from sampling the original film.  The exposure filter is by far
the better way, and it is very widely used by film scanners.  I think
you want to use the film scanner in its color negative mode if that is
what you are scanning.


text:
Kennedy McEwen <[email]> wrote in message news:<[email]>...

Could you elaborate with this specific example?

Minolta Elite II. At 2880dpi with ICE enabled, at 16 bits it takes
about 5-6 minutes for a finished scan when filn type is set to colour
negative. It takes about 2 minutes when film type is set for colour
positive. Both results are with FireWire connection, the computer is
neither CPU (1.4GHz) nor memory (1Gb) bound, with native Minolta
software. *ALL* scanner passes, including focussing are perceivably
faster when film is set to "colour positive".

Do I really lose that much information in the channles if I deploy the
following process:

1. Scan as positive at 16 bits (make sure that damn autoexposure is
OFF, yet another option not available for neg scanning)
2. Set white point to the sampled colour of the orange mask
3. Invert the image
4. S-curve it for reasonable contrast (expand the dynamic range)
5. At this point we have pretty much emulated the proof-printing, and
now, the image can be converted to 8bit for any needed manipulations
or finer adjustmenst with layers.

Note that the first four steps are all done on the 16 bits image with
65000 samples per channel. Thus, banding of the resulting 8 bits image
is not an issue. "Clipping" is still an issue. That's the part I
cannot understand. Subjectively, the process above gives compatible
results with straight negative scan, with the benefits of 3 minutes of
scanning time replaced with two clicks.
Objectively, I cheerfully admit ignorance. Please, enlighten me.

Now, take the latest VueScan. The speed when scanning in negative mode
is faster than with Minolta software (mostly for focussing), but still
slower than Minolta in positive mode (you gave a good explanation of
it by stating that exposure times for G and B are increased), however,
the quality of the resulting image plainly sucks: the colour cast is
so large as if the scanner was not <CTRL><SHIFT><I>. Did I do
something wrong? Should the scanner be calibrated via Minolta software
first? Is there any sacred knowledge about VueScan which is available
only in the group? I followed the VueScan manual to the letter,
setting the film type, etc.

Thus, today, my conclusions are: to use native Minolta software (much
better results with straight negative scans, the only complain is the
scan time, as compaired with VueScan), and use "positive mode" with
16bits scan, with some more experimetations about orange mask removal,
unless proven that it does lose significant portion of the colour
information (the scanner "sings joyfully" as opposed to "roar" when
film type is set to "positive"). Using slide film is not an option, as
99% of my shots are portraiture, and people want to see prints, not
deliberate on "which loupe is better". (see
http://www.pbase.com/bubobubo/faces for example)

Best regards,
Igor


author: Ed Hamrick

text:
"karmadon" <[email]> wrote:

VueScan uses a fixed multipler for the green and blue channels,
but this is scanner dependant.  It's 1.0, 2.5, 3.5 for red, green
and blue CCD exposure time on most scanners.

Using fixed multipliers instead of making the multipliers image
dependant makes color correction of saved raw scan files easier.
If this wasn't done, the multipliers used for each raw scan file
would have to be saved in the raw scan files.

Regards,
Ed Hamrick


text:
Good explanation, Wayne.  I wonder where Ian Lyons is coming from
when he says the other method works better ?  Have you read hisd
turorial at www.computer-darkroom.co.uk, click on "Alternative
Scanning Method for Colour Negative Film" ?

I guess he's talking in the context of SOME very crappy scanner-
supplied software.  Which we don't have to deal with thanks to
Ed !

John


text:
I'm consfused. If you're scanning, what difference does it make if you use
negative or reversal in terms of producing prints easily ?   Or is it
just easier to have your proof prints made by a lab ?  Even given that,
if they have something like a Fuji Frontier it doesn't make any difference.

John


text:
In article <akobfv$e0o$[email]>, [email] says...

I think you're right.  There is the one sentence about "even the most
expensive scanner applications", but otherwise I dont read Ian as
exactly proposing that method to be generally superior. The emphasis
seems to be where he says "However, not all scanner software is created
equal and some is just plain useless at scanning negatives" and he says
"The following is a technique used by many who find themselves doing
battle with inadequate scanner software". These are strong conditionals,
which reads like "if there is no other choice" to me (and certainly the
orange mask is a difficult problem if the software cant do it well).

My bet is on VueScan's exposure method. I guess VueScan is NOT one of
those "expensive applications". <g>  It is the conventional way, but
even if using the same method, all software does not have the same
skill.


text:
[email] (John Eyles) wrote in message news:<akobrb$e1t$[email]>...

It is simply unpractical to, say, scan ten rolls of 36 frames after a
wedding. Of course I use lab for proofs, as well as for enlargements,
digitised or not. But you are right, for Frontiers, at least in
theory, it matters not, trannies or negs.


author: K&C Hayward

subject: HP 932 vs 952

text:
Is the photo paper tray the only difference between these two printers?
Does anyone have a 952?  Is the tray worthwhile?

Thanks.


author: BF

subject: Re: HP 932 vs 952

text:
I think the 952 is a little faster, but other than that print quality is
supposed to be the same.

"K&C Hayward" <[email]> wrote in message
news:[email]...


author: Ron Marshall

subject: Re: HP 932 vs 952

text:
I just decided to buy the HP 950 over the HP 930.  As someone already stated
the 950 is faster.  The reason that I got the 950 was that the printer case
and the paper trays for the 950 were of better quality (IMHO). The picture
quality on the two is said to be the same.  I know the print quality on the
950 is GREAT.  Beats the heck out of the HP 722 I had, and that is a good
printer.
Ron M.

"K&C Hayward" <[email]> wrote in message
news:[email]...


author: [redacted]

subject: Re: HP 932 vs 952

text:
K&C Hayward <[email]> wrote:

I have the 952. It's marginally faster than a 93X, but the tray is significantly
better - and not just for photos.


author: John Williams

subject: Windows XP vs Linux

text:
Windows XP vs Linux

I have been a Linux user for about ten months. My distribution of choice is
Mandrake 8, which has good hardware detection and is the most accessible one
for newbies.

However, I recently upgraded my WinMe PC to Windows XP Home Edition, and this
is how I think it compares to Mandrake for the average home user:

(John gets up from his seat, goes up the stairs to the presidential platform,
waits for the fanfare to end and gets ready to deliver his speech)

1) User Interface, desktop environment

Let me start by saying that Windows XP is drop dead gorgeous. Rounded buttons
with highlights and shadows, font smoothing, lovely icons and the most user
friendly interface yet. It's wonderful to use.
Mandrake's default desktop environment, KDE, is amateurish, crude and
unprofessional. A major problem is the lack of quality fonts, and each
application needing it's own fonts. With a default installation of Mandrake
the KDE desktop will look like garbage.

Computers are tools which should help people get things done easy. An operating
system like Linux, which is designed for technically-minded nerds, is not the
most adequate one for home users.

2) Stability

Bad news for the Linux community - Windows XP is built on an NT core - so that
means it's powerful and stable. And, depending on which distribution you are
using, Windows XP might even give better performance (and are the programs you
want to run available for Linux? Is your hardware supported? ha!)

Linux stability is a myth. It's okay if you're using some utility in console
mode (the console being an obsolete way of doing things) but add a GUI and some
real applications and stability and performance will go down the drain.

3) Software

As a gamer, a Windows XP PC is my platform of choice. I like complex strategy,
role-playing and first person shooters - the kind of stuff that is either not
available for console users or is impossible to play properly in a console (no
glorious high resolution and proper controls - where is the mouse and
keyboard?)

When it comes to apps, Mediaplayer 8 is a fantastic multimedia center - it's
colorful, user-friendly, powerful and tightly integrated with the rest of
Windows XP and Internet Explorer 6.
Office XP is a glorious office suite - the industry standard, and it kicks the
butt of every single Linux pretender.

Every single little program that you want to use is available for
Windows, and they are a doodle to install - just double click on the file and
that's it. No need to mess around with any of that console crap. And why on
earth do I have to waste time hunting for the Linux alternatives - they are
not better - and are a pain in the ass to install and use. And I had already
discovered that there's nothing you can do in Linux that can't be done better
in Windows.

4) Hardware support

Although the likes of Mandrake 8.1 are closing the gap, we all know that Linux
will always have driver problems. Even if you do manage to find the right
drivers for your hardware (unlikely) they are still a nightmare to install!
Windows XP has full Plug & Play, as a matter of fact it detected and correctly
installed drivers for all the hardware in my system. Microsoft's "driver
signing" policy is not an inconvenience, it just makes sure you are using
drivers that have been tested with their cool new OS. You can get these
Microsoft approved drivers through Windows Update, how easy peasy.

5) Internet

Linux might be a powerful server platform, but so is Windows XP Professional.

However as a home user, I just want to browse the web, read my email and chat.

And........... Linux is lagging behind again!

There is no decent browser for Linux. Mandrake's default browser, Netscape
4.77 lacks features, is slow and crash-prone and looks terrible. Netscape 6 is
even worse, slower and so unstable it's not even worth using. Then there is
Konqueror - it still has problems displaying certain web sites and unless you
manage to sort out your fonts they will look like garbage. Mozilla and Opera
come closer to getting it right but still can't match IE's looks, speed and
fantastic interface - plus bear in mind that most websites these days are
designed with IE in mind (because that's what everyone is using, folks).

Internet Explorer 6 and Outlook Express are an unbeatable duo - please don't
get me started on all the crappy stone-age email programs that come with Linux.

As far as chat programs go, most people use web-based chat services these
days - and you can't access Microsoft's super-cool MSchat service from any of
the Linux browsers - haha!

So there you go, I can say this again: LINUX SUCKS!

(Finishes his speech and walks up to Linus Torvalds - grabs him by the neck
and slaps his sorry butt ten times - "let me give you open source, you
cretin!")

Note: John Williams is the author of the mega-popular thread "WinMe vs Linux",
which is a Usenet classic and has provoked thousands of responses and lively
discussion in the Linux forums.


author: Jacek Popławski

subject: Re: Windows XP vs Linux

text:
John Williams wrote:

Windows users can't read. It's newsgroup about hardware.