text:
Before my time, so I can't tell you if it was Curtis's or Marketing.
Besides, it is irrelevant at this point as the product is there and
shipping in 7 today.  On top of that, a Sol x86 version has been part
of the OpenOffice community through the 1.1, so baseline development
and testing was done by the Sun team (with help from the community).

Yes he mis-spoke.  If StarOffice x86 was the key factor causing delay,
don't you think that you would see JDS on Sol x86 today?   There is
still a lot of work happening on the OSS applications and HCL.  At
this point, I would suggest you focus your efforts on getting a Sol
x86 port of Evolution, Mozilla, etc. as well as get the necessary
drivers in place as that would go a long way in shortening the
development cycle

I'm not sure I'm understanding what you are saying.  We launched a
desktop client that was based on Linux, specifically targeted at the
enterprises that we looking/commited to Linux.  We had, even at this
time, GNOME, Mozilla, Star running on Solaris.  What is the point that
you are trying to make?  We had a Linux version and a Solaris version.

The article you refer to specifically is discussing Sun's decision to
abandon Sun Linux.

You are talking about a launch message.  At the MadHatter launch,
JIS's speech was specifically in place to launch a turnkey, blackbox
enterprise client that would extend Sun into the emerging
"Linux-preferred" market.  At the same keynote, JIS did demonstrate
the Sun Ray in that demo (with the enterprise client) as the Java Card
was a core feature for security that was also launched at SNC 2002.

Similar to my earlier statement, your help in getting the latest
versions of GNOME, Mozilla, Evolution, etc to Solaris (SPARC and Sol
x86) would go a long way in getting these products to market a lot
faster.

The full productization is still under development because of lack of
OSS application support (GNOME 2.x, Evolution 2.x, rDesktop, GIMP,
etc.) The other components they come for free for Solaris.   They also
ship with the workstations and the Sun Ray's, so there is no need to
purchase separately on the store.

http://wwws.sun.com/software/star/gnome/get/index.html
http://wwws.sun.com/software/solaris/browser/

Ximian is available through Novell:

http://rpmfind.net/linux/RPM/ximian/ximian-evolution/solaris-8-sun4/

And StarOffice for Solaris x86 is available through the store and from
OpenOffice.org

-peder


author: Beardy

subject: Re: Why is SUN falling so far behind IBM?

text:
Joerg Schilling wrote:

Joerg, it is *such* a shame that you did not call your wonderful product
"JStar" - that way, we could have had an equivalent "confusion" over
Sun's potential product "Java StarOffice" (JStar) ;-)


author: John D Groenveld

text:
In article <[email]>,
peder <[email]> wrote:

I'm no MBA but I would first look to Marketing when assigning bugids
related to customers' false impressions.

Yes. I purchased a copy as soon at shipped in late January or early
February several months after it went FCS for Microsoft Windows,
Linux, and Solaris (SPARC).

BTW it is precisely relevant to this thread that customers had to
lobby Desktop Software and senior management to convince Sun to put
Solaris x86 back on the StarOffice product roadmap.

I don't even want to think about the internal politicking.


author: Benjamin Gawert

text:
"Arthur Corliss" <[email]>  wrote:

Right. But the current compilers from intel are quite good at
optimization...

for

Maybe. But at least our software angineers have no problem with wasted
bandwith on Itanium. And from what I know most other ISV don't have that
problem, too.

R14k

Right. So what? Of course when comparing performance/clock cycle MIPS still
is good. But MHz as a performance criteria is more something for the PC
Kiddies. The CPU clock is quite irrelevant. Who cares when MIPS does more
instructions per clock cycle when the architecture limits the achievable max
performance way below what other modern processors do. Of course the
performance/clock ratio is better than on the R14k-600 than on the POWER4
1.7, but in the end the POWER4 offers much more overall performance than the
R14k...

processors.
watts
draw.
architectures

Yes, historically. For sure it's efficient (that's btw the reason why MIPS
is so widespread in the embedded market), but it's not fast. The
architecture simply can't keep up with other CPUs when it comes to absolute
performance. And we don't buy a platform because it is so good at doing lots
of instructions per clock cycle (that's more interesting for discussions in
comp.sys.arch), we buy it because of its absolute application performance.
And that's where MIPS simply is behind all competition...

Yes, because SGI sold most of it's assets like Cray, Softimage, and also
including parts of their round hq building in San Jose), and their
increasing success with their Linux-based ALTIX systems. MIPS/IRIX is
something that costs SGI more than what it brings as renevue. The few
MIPS/IRIX sales are almost all just upgrade sales to the remaining existing
MIPS/IRIX customers. During the last years SGI wasn't able to aquire new
customers with MIPS/IRIX, instead of this they lost a big bunch of
traditional customers to other system vendors which offered a better
performance...

MIPS/IRIX is certainly not the _reason_ they are still in business. It's
more a fact that _despite_ MIPS/IRIX SGI is still in business...

NUMAflex

Yes, but on the other side the Itanium CPUs are much faster than the fastest
MIPS offerings, so for having the same performance You need less CPUs than
on MIPS...

Internal is definite that IRIX/MIPS is going to die. And You see SGI putting
most of their ressources in Linux/ALTIX, while the MIPS series is somewhat
stagnating for some years now. IRIX of course gets its maintenance and
improvements, but it's very unlikely that we'll ever see a new IRIX
version...

Well, at least DEC had technology that was performing very good. That's not
the case for SGI MIPS...

Benjamin


author: Alan Coopersmith

text:
[email] (peder) writes in comp.unix.solaris:
|Yes he mis-spoke.  If StarOffice x86 was the key factor causing delay,
|don't you think that you would see JDS on Sol x86 today?   There is
|still a lot of work happening on the OSS applications and HCL.  At
|this point, I would suggest you focus your efforts on getting a Sol
|x86 port of Evolution, Mozilla, etc. as well as get the necessary
|drivers in place as that would go a long way in shortening the
|development cycle

Solaris x86 ports of Evolution, Mozilla, etc. were done a long time ago,
so are hardly a plausible reason for any delay.

|Similar to my earlier statement, your help in getting the latest
|versions of GNOME, Mozilla, Evolution, etc to Solaris (SPARC and Sol
|x86) would go a long way in getting these products to market a lot
|faster.

They're generally available for Solaris and Linux at the same time from
the open source community, so there is no way this can help.

|> Why is JDS for Solaris (SPARC) and the Sun Ray still not available
|> for purchase from SunStore [3]?
|
|The full productization is still under development because of lack of
|OSS application support (GNOME 2.x, Evolution 2.x, rDesktop, GIMP,
|etc.)

Evolution 2.x doesn't exist yet, the others have all supported Solaris
(sparc & x86) for quite a long time - there's several places to get
unsupported packages for Solaris from people other than Sun.


author: Thierry Besancon

text:
Dixit [email] (peder) (le 5 Aug 2004 20:36:50 -0700) :

��� And StarOffice for Solaris x86 is available through the store and from
��� OpenOffice.org

What about Acrobat Reader for Solaris x86 ? The latest version for
Solaris x86 is 4.x. Does anybody knows if there is a plan for Solaris
x86 ? (I'm not interested a lot in xpdf so let's not evoke it as a work
around) For me, acrobat reader is a *MUST* on my unix box. I was very
disappointed when I realized acrobat reader was not available on
solaris x86. I was hoping to install solaris 10 on a test box but that
stopped me. I'm still thinking on whether or not go on.

(more generally, why is Adobe postponing acrobat 6 on Unix
workstations compared to mac/windows boxes ?)

Best regards.

        Thierry Besancon


author: peder

text:
True, but not so true.  You even pointed out the quality issue of
Mozilla on GNOME in Solaris in an earlier post.  The ports that were
done are based on older technology and have issues around quality,
interoperability and scale.  I got my versioning wrong on Evo (my
fault), but the versions that are supported today are based on GNOME
2.0 and Evolution 1.2   What is needed to get to the level of
functionality that is ready for mainstream production requires GNOME
2.4 at a minimum with 2.6 being ideal.  That enables us to also run
Evolution 1.6 - which is dependant on later versions of GNOME.  The
Sun SW Engineering team has been working around the clock to get the
updates and features into the platform.

On top of the Evo and GNOME packages, there are a number of things in
JDS that still need porting - ranging from the integrated installer
and application management tool (like YAST in JDS), a number of the
OSS components from DVD players, GIMP, rDESKTOP, etc.  And yes I
understand that many of these applicaitons exist in Sol x86 today, but
remeber the engineering teams have to build, integrate and sustain the
platform at it is in the best interest to have a single set of apps
across all platforms than many solutions cobbled together differently
across platforms.

Fair, but understand that these packages end up going through
rewrites, integration and testing within Sun and there tends to be a
lot of work that needs to happen to get these to customer quality
standards - and I can't tell you why that is - but more help from this
community on integration and quality would definitely help.

I am definitely not the one to go through and debate versions, code,
etc. as I am by no means technically minded.  The bigger comment that
I am pushing here is that there is no action by the Mktg or
Engineering teams to delay or avoid Solaris or Solaris x86 over Linux.
 I wanted to put that to rest and hopefully stop the rediculous posts
that put blame on the Desktop team or my past as to why something
doesn't exist, or why it is delayed for Solaris x86.  And I have to
say that it is disheartening and frustrating for the teams involved
(engineering, marketing, etc.), who are working hard on productizing
these elements so that they are "customer ready", to read posts that
go against/discredit their hard work, or make assumptions that are
false and pulled out of thin air.


author: Arthur Corliss

text:
On 2004-08-08, Benjamin Gawert <[email]> wrote:

I would hope so, it's their chip.  But I can't help but think that there's
going to be a lot of real-world apps whose logic won't fit well in the
templates, wasting a good chunk of Itanium's theoretical throughput.  I have
a bit more faith in branch prediction logic in eeking a bit more out of
unexpected tasks than a predefined template system.

Have they even done statistcal modeling to see what they should be getting
compared to what they are getting?  Most engineers seem to be just ducky
out-performing the last code base, without really understanding just what
they should be getting out of the hardware.

It matters a great deal when you consider that for all the nice benchmarks
these processors get they still spend a considerable chunk of thier time
idle due to data starvation.  This is the key difference between SGI and
and other vendors:  they spend a hell of a lot of time ignoring external
bottlenecks while SGI works on resolving those instead.

I would put forth that it's reasons like this why customers like
Wright-Patterson AFB still put out the bucks for Origins.  The pipeline to
the processor is kept a hell of a lot fuller in them.

Yes and no.  I agree that MIPS hasn't pursued the "easy" optimisations like
they could have (when SGI had direct control), but by the same token, as I
mentioned above, they did compensate by trying to ensure nothing external
to the processor was going to slow things down as well.  That may have not
compensated fully for the lack of clock rate, but it does make a huge
difference.

And at the same time I will put forth my assertion that if MIPS had been
pushed like the other RISC architectures that it could be a superior
computing architecture, even today.  The processors would use a fraction
of the die size and power for equivalent performance.

Don't get me wrong:  my shop is primarily an IBM shop (p & iSeries), so I
like IBM's hardware.  But let's face it:  the Power-n processor is to
hardware what modern applications (dare I say it?  C++ code ;-) are to
software -- extremely fat and bloated.  The only saving grace is that
processors, for all their bloat, do appear to gain us some performance
improvements, while the latest software merely serves to make those new
processors feel as snappy as our old Z80s.

Cray is much better off without SGI's mishandling (completely two different
philosophies of scaled computing), but selling off non-core business units
is hardly the only way SGI has stayed in business (though it has helped).

To refute your assertions that Altix/Linux is the only thing bringing in
new revenue I would point out only one of their publically listed "customer
successes" in servers mentions the Altix, each of the others mention the
Origin.  And look at successes under visualization systems, that, too, is
dominated by Onyxs and Origins.  If the Altix was that vital to their revenue
stream I'd think they'd do a hell of a lot more press releases on it,
wouldn't you?

I wholeheartedly disagree.  See above.

Did you not read my post?  I think I was pretty clear in saying that in the
real world clock rate means nothing if you're just sitting, waiting for data
to work on.  Which is why the Origin is so effective, even at the slower
rates.

<G> Compare the original 6.5 to 6.5.13, and that to 6.5.23.  The versions
lie, my friend, there's been major enhancements within the 6.5 stream.  SGI
just doesn't feel the need to pull a Sun-like move to pretend to advance the
platform.  How big a jump was 2.7 to Solaris 8?  I don't believe for a minute
that they've improved Solaris from 2.7 to 9 as must as IRIX has improved
within the 6.5 series.

I disagree.  The Alpha is a great chip, but I wouldn't rate MIPS too far
behind.  I'd take a MIPS box over a Sparc box anyday, that's for sure.  And
there's a good reason why my Octane sees more use than the Athlon-based box
next to it, even though the Athlon is several multiples faster than my R12k...


author: Michael Kraemer

text:
In article <[email]>, "Benjamin Gawert" <[email]> writes:
(snip)

Reading such analyses (downfall of companies & architectures)
I always wonder if it was really inevitable, or if people just confuse
cause and effect.
Had SGI invested early enough in MIPS development they would be
in better shape today. I cant see why MIPS couldnt be made more
competitive, if the only wanted.
What nearly killed them was their detour into
windoze universe.
I guess many/big customers look closely at the
committment of vendors to their product before shelling out lots of
money. Companies playing flip-flop will loose.
A company which sends the signal (implicitly or explicitly) that they
wouldnt develop further their product will loose their customer.
In hindsight this looks as being  inevitable, but I doubt that.

This has happened several times IMHO, see eg 68k vs x86, or the
crumbling of the DEC universe.


author: Joerg Schilling

text:
In article <41127e81$0$12898$[email]>,
Beardy  <[email]> wrote:

I have no problems when people use "Ess TAR Office" ;-)


text:
Arthur Corliss wrote:

Yes, of course. And comparisons with other platforms as well...

Well, our engineers are quite experienced in HPC programming, most of them
already had a long-term experience when they came to us. We don't recruit
some Visual Studio Windows programmers...

Well, military often buys for reasons other than performance (I know that as
we supply a lot of military customers)...

Maybe, but only because the MIPS processor is much slower to finish the
tasks ;-)

Altix and Origin for example share the exactly same architecture (with the
Altix gotting some additional improvements). I really doubt that the Origin
can even come somewhat close to throughput...

Well, no. The _only_ advantage of Origin was their scalability to 2048 CPUs,
but with the new Itanium products from SGI that's nothing special any more.
And for the vast majority of HPC installations the scalability of Sun, IBM
and HP was more than sufficient because the number of customers requiring
that much CPUs is really really low. Origin had a very fast I/O architecture
but still isn't top-mark any more, and that for some time now. And fast I/O
can't compensate for low CPU performance, which is the reason why SGI
changed to Itanium while keeping the basic architecture...

No. There are lots of factors in the MIPS architecture which makes it
different to achieve a better performance or a higher clock rate. SGI
itself, which had a very good development team, failed because of these
limitations. You can't just shrink the die and expect to be able to raise
clock rates at infinitum...

We're getting more and more an HP shop, so I have no current insights into
the pSeries. But my impression is that IBM is somewhat the opposite of SGI:
very strong CPUs with a relative low bandwith. Can't say if this is correct
for the current machines, though...

It was more than just help. Look at the financial situation SGI has been at
that times. Selling their assets was the only way to stay in business long
enough to get Altix started...

No. I know from a lot of sites that bought Altix systems. It seems sell
quite well. On the other side there aren't many MIPS/IRIX sales, and the few
sales are all upgrades or expansions from traditional IRIX customers (like
the said military agencies). SGI hasn't aquired new customers with IRIX for
a long time, and even the traditional customers that have bought now know
that this will be the last sale of MIPS/IRIX, and that it's time thinking of
moving on to something different.

Press Releases are fine, but if You read between the lines You'll see that
the MIPS/IRIX line hasn't a very hig priority at SGI any more. They are
working on moving their visualisation centers to Itanium, because today SGI
has some real competition in this area, and with Sun and HP offering more
performance than You can squeeze out of the old MIPS systems...

I/O is nothing if the CPU is slow like hell. A system is only as good as the
weakest part. I/O on Origin is good but not as good as on Altix or
Superdome...

What major enhancements? I have 6.5.24 here and besides from a lot of error
fixes (and introduction of a lot of new errors and incompatibilities) there
are lots of smaller improvements, but IMHO nothing special when thinking
that SGI is carrying IRIX 6.5 for over 6 years now.

Well, the experience we had when we had SGI and Alpha tells me otherwise...

Well, for hobby use the criteria might be different, and of course I can't
say anything about Your home use or Your Athlon (besides this, I find
comparisons between a cheap standard PC and a RISC workstation rather
useless). But I never would go back to work from my PC workstations to my
Octane, it's just much too slow and too limited for the work I have to do...

Benjamin


text:
Michael Kraemer wrote:

Simply because the costs for MIPS developments are high, and they had
serious troubles raising the limits of the MIPS architecture to keep
somewhat current in performance...

Well, not really. Windows became a target when SGI still was in bad
financial shape. The problem they had was that they thought the Windows
market could be handled like the traditional UNIX market - with high margins
and proprietary technology. Their Visual Workstations (SGI320 with Dual
P2/P3 and SGI 540 with 4x XEON) suffered from a lot of design problems:
proprietary memory with the certainly most stupid memory sockets ever made,
3.3V PCI instead of 5V PCI (at that time 3.3V PCI was very uncommon),
non-working firewire ports, USB ports that are incompatible with most USB
devices in the world except mouse and keyboard, no BIOS (machine had PROM
firmware instead of BIOS which made special OS versions necessary), and
buggy drivers. Oh, and not to forget flakey PSUs (something like an SGI
trademark). The Cobalt gfx chipset with Shared-Memory-Gfx resultet in very
poor memory performance. And these machines were much more expensive than
even faster machines from IBM, Dell or HP. Later machines were just plain
standard PCs with Nvidia Quadro256 gfx but also at a higher price...

Not necessarily. A good example is Tru64, HP announced the end-of-life for
AXP and Tru64 long before and offers tools and support for migration to
another platform. IBM has done the same with for example the RT-PC customers
migrating to RS/6000. Fujitsu-Siemens offered their customers a migration
path from the dying RM-Series running ReliantUNIX to the PrimePower
machines.

EOL'ing a product is not a problem if handled correctly. That means the
customers get informations in a very early stage, and the manufacturer
offers migration plans and support from day one of the EOL announcement.

Well, the DEC story was different because DEC had everything important:
technology with up-to-date performance, a lot of ISVs offering software for
their platforms and a huge customer base. The only problem they had was
marketing.

SGI on the other side also suffered from bad marketing, but also from
difficulties to push their MIPS systems to the next performance level. And
they lost most of their ISVs. So their decision to concentrate more and more
on IA64 and Linux was the best step to rescue what's remaining...

Benjamin


author: Linønut

text:
Error BR-549: MS DRM 1.0 rejects the following post from Thierry Besancon:

Maybe because xpdf and ghostview do the job already, and some bean counter
noticed.

Or because Adobe Acrobat 6 is only necessary on Mac/Windoze to fix some major
exploit (our corporate IT has been bombarding us with emails saying that a
patch is not available, we have to upgrade to 6, but I avoid Adobe anyway just
because of the frickin' startup banner and its slow speed [on Windoze]
relative to xpdf [on Linux]).


text:
On 2004-08-24, Benjamin Gawert <[email]> wrote:

I'd be interested in hearing what other platforms they compared the
Itanium systems to, and what they found.  According to the latest
market-speak from IBM the Power5 blows the doors of the fastest Itanium2.

;-) Which is always a wise decision.

I used to be in the service (though being in the poorest, the Marines, meant
we can't afford as many toys as the others).  A lot factors go into it the
purchase, but they're not all stupid.  The Pentagon doesn't usually let
money go to waste on high-dollar, highly visible projects.  Most of the waste
is in the two dollar items that we buy for two hundred.  :-P  *This*
particular purchase was very well researched.

Yes, MIPS can't compete in clock-rate, no one's trying to tell you otherwise.
But I'd rather have a system that the I/O is keeping the processors at 100%
utilisation than another that still has the CPUs mostly idle.  And that's
exactly what I'm talking about.  The reality is that while CPU clock rates
in some architectures have gone up dramatically, system bandwidth to it has
been *much* less stellar.  And if you think actual need pushed the Intel
clock rate more than the marketing value I've got a bridge to sell you (I'll
even deliver ;-).

Streams benchmark, while impressive, don't show real world performance.  But
I doubt the differential is too big, all the bricks are for the most part
identical, with the exception of the C & R bricks.

All you need to maintain performance is for the CPUs to be fast enough to
handle a saturated bus.  The Origin can, at that.  I still think you're
missing the point:  the best system isn't the one with the best I/O or the
best CPU clock-rate, it's the system that's *balanced* in all respects,
with no subsystems going idle due to data starvation.  SGI has done that
better than just about anyone, with the possible exception of Cray (in
non-occupation mode, of course).

Wrong.  There's lots of factors in doing it *right*, instead of cheating
like Intel and just lengthening the pipeline.  And despite a good development
team (keep in mind that Cray's same development team is now resurging out
from under the thumb of SGI), any real progress can be killed by incompentent
management (read:  MS stooge Rick Belluzzo), especially when they're
directed to act outside of their core competency (x86 Windows workstations).

The Power series is a nice processor, but make no mistake about it:  it's a
beast.  In retrospect they could should have done a lot of things cleaner,
or I wouldn't have the OS running chunks of kernel code through system
firmware because the instructions sets in the processor differ so much
(AIX 4.3, for instance, runs from the PowerPC 604e to the Power-3, and
most platforms do partial processor emulation for non-native instrutions
found in the binaries).

That's debatable.  As you pointed out in your government dig above, the
defense industry is a *big* user of SGI, and continues to be so.  Not to
mention (and I can say this from personal observation up here in Alaska)
the oil industry and universities doing pure science research.  IBM's made
a lot of inroads the last few years, but SGI still has a solid foothold in
all of that.

Well, we obviously have reached opposite conclusions from "reading between
the lines".  I read that the Altix is still experimental (born out by
articles interviewing actual users) while the Origin is established and
reliable.

I'd wager that the Origin, running the same MPI code, sees less real
bottlenecks than the Altix.  I have no doubt that there's a lot of idle
subsystems waiting for data on the typical Altix.  And that is magnified
due to the lack of a mature dynamic load balancing tools, etc.

How definitive a list do you want?  I'm sure you'll want to quibble as to
how important or "major" the enhancements are, but let's see:

6.5.2  Opportunistic locking support on filesystems
       Motif 2.1/ViewKit 2.1
6.5.3  LDAP 3.0 support for UNS
6.5.4  DCE/DFS client support
6.5.5  XFS v2
       CXFS v1
6.5.6  multithreaded autofsd
6.5.7  job limits
6.5.8  DSO miser implementation w/improvements
       Comprehensive System accounting
6.5.9  Disk quotas by projects
       Batch scheduler improvements
6.5.11 Reserved memory area
       Weightless pthreads
       Higher LUN units allowed
       Partitioned environment licensing
6.5.13 cpusetAttach/DetachPID
       XVM w/CXFS
6.5.14 GUI refresh of the Interactive Desktop
6.5.15 XFS Group quotas
       2TB disk support
       /dev/poll for event notification
6.5.16 multi-OS clients for CXFS
       I/O fencing
       New job limit kernel parameters
       rtmond improvements for 128+ CPU systems
       Array service scaling
       mpadmin
6.5.17 XVM snapshots
       On-line documentation upgrade to open standards
       NFSv3 improvements
6.5.18 UDF support
       Processor timer load management for real-time apps
6.5.19 CXFS 512byte direct I/O support
       /dev/random, /dev/urandom
       rdrtc() addition to libc
       openssh/ssl
       IPv6
       Sendmail overhaul
6.5.20 MP3 & other codecs integration in dmedia
       OpenGL Shader 3
       Kerberos v5
       OpenLDAP w/TLS/SSL & Kerberos support
       UDF write-capable driver
       Switch to Apache from Fasttrack
       Trusted IRIX
6.5.21 tcp_wrappers
       sysdump
       low overhead pthread mutex protocol
       NFS ACL enhancements
6.5.22 case-insensitive filename support for XFS
       PAM
       NFS async I/O support, offline exportfs, etc.
       ntp
       Bind 9
6.5.23 Dropped old PS/PDF tools for OS alternatives
       Infinite Network Bandwidth
       POSIX pthread barriers & spinlocks
       IPv6 rtmond support
6.5.24 GRIO v2
       XVM multi-host fail-over

And this is just the stuff I care about, omitting the expanded hardware
support, bug fixes, and major improvements in staple applications.  For that
matter, I've ignore the "Application CD" updates as well.

In short, the enhancements added by SGI from 1998 to present have had a
much more meaningful impact than the "improvements" from Sun for the same
period.

I admin many versions of UNIX for a living, so can the hobby insults.  The
"cheap PC" crap was brought into it by you with the whole Intel vein, with
the Itanium being just the latest generation CPU.  The sad truth is that my
Octane makes an even better X station than any given PC with a multiple
clock rate.  At my job I live in xterms, with C & Perl in vi a large part of
it, to automate routine sysadmin tasks.

The fact of the matter is that I don't get the jerky PC syndrome just becase
I kicked off some tar processes or try to cache to large a recordset from
a db client in memory.  For *my* kind of work the PC, ironically enough, is
still too limited, and the clock rate didn't help a damned bit.  The lack
of decent I/O is a killer.


text:
[email] (peder) writes in comp.unix.solaris:
|> Solaris x86 ports of Evolution, Mozilla, etc. were done a long time ago,
|> so are hardly a plausible reason for any delay.
|
|True, but not so true.  You even pointed out the quality issue of
|Mozilla on GNOME in Solaris in an earlier post.

No, I pointed out the lack of integration between Mozilla & GNOME.
I don't see why it would be specific to Solaris, but I don't have
a JDS/Linux box handy to check on.  In any case, the point remains
that delay in Solaris/x86 releases has been primarily a resource
issue and has very little basis in technical barriers.

|I am definitely not the one to go through and debate versions, code,
|etc. as I am by no means technically minded.  The bigger comment that
|I am pushing here is that there is no action by the Mktg or
|Engineering teams to delay or avoid Solaris or Solaris x86 over Linux.
| I wanted to put that to rest and hopefully stop the rediculous posts
|that put blame on the Desktop team or my past as to why something
|doesn't exist, or why it is delayed for Solaris x86.  And I have to
|say that it is disheartening and frustrating for the teams involved
|(engineering, marketing, etc.), who are working hard on productizing
|these elements so that they are "customer ready", to read posts that
|go against/discredit their hard work, or make assumptions that are
|false and pulled out of thin air.

I agree the engineering teams are not at fault - they were simply
following the instructions from their management, who made plans and set
budgets for the Desktop software engineering groups when they only had
two platforms to worry about (Solaris/sparc and Linux/x86 since
Solaris/x86 was on indefinite delay company-wide), and then had to
adjust to try to work in a third platform, doing more work with less
resources (due to the company-wide layoffs).  Those managers had to
decide to delay or skip Solaris/x86 releases of some products, and
unfortunately, poor explanations were given at the time, and even now
they haven't been well communicated as this discussion shows.
Fortunately, misunderstandings like "Solaris/x86 is only for servers so
we don't need desktop software" didn't last long, and were firmly killed
when the planning for the new Opteron workstations went into full swing.
Armchair quarterbacking about whether or not all the decisions over the
past two years were correct and justified won't help now, and not even
those of us on the inside know all the factors and details that went
into those decisions, nor should we.  At some level, we (both those
inside Sun and those outside like John G) have to believe that Curtis
Sasaki and his team had good reasons for their decisions and the best
interests of Sun and our customers in mind, even if they're not
decisions we agreed with, and hope that Curtis's successor and his team
continue to do so.  Maybe they'll join the movement towards greater
transparency and customer communications to reduce future unhappiness on
issues like this - it's a bit strange at the moment that efforts to do
so, such as blogs.sun.com are pushing up from the bottom of the org
chart, with many engineers and other "individual contributors"
participating - including quite a few members of the JDS engineering
teams, and pushing down from the top, with people like Jonathan Schwartz
and John Fowler participating, but hasn't met in the middle yet, with
the layers of middle management still out of the picture - yet that's
where decisions like this are made and best explained.  (For instance,
you can find my blog on blogs.sun.com, and that of the VP I work for,
Glenn Weinberg, but you won't find the manager I report to, the senior
manager he reports to, or the director he reports to (who in turn
reports to Glenn).)


author: WSI Nationwide, Inc.

subject: US-NJ-732-JD Edwards Certified / Kronos World Programmer/Analyst-WSI

text:
I have been asked to identify Independent Consultant JD Edwards certified-Kronos
Programmer / Analyst local NY / NJ / CT / PA candidates, (no interviewing or
travel expenses are available, no Visa Sponsorship available and no 3rd party
referrals or agencies, please) for a Middlesex / Union County Northern New
Jersey project requiring Independent Contractors, (easily commutable on public
transportation from New York City.)

Qualified local New York / New Jersey / Connecticut / Pennsylvania JD Edwards /
Kronos Programmer/Analyst candidates must have experience implementing Kronos
and interfacing it to JD Edwards World Software and have JD Edwards / JDE
Certification.  Kronos is a time/labor management product.  Excellent
communication skills are a must.  Strong Analytical ability is required.  Must
be a self starter and be able to work independently.  Experience with Vertex is
a big plus.  Environment: RPG 400, RPG III, CL, AS400 Utilities, Kronos, Vertex,
JDE World, Synon, Data3.

This is a long term contract in the New Brunswick / Somerset, New Jersey area
offering an initial three to six month long term renewable contact with a
flexible starting rate in the $680 to $760 per day range depending on
experience, (including expenses).  Your asking compensation will be submitted
after your approval.

Please include your rate range and your availability with your
response and a brief explanation of the specific skills / experience
you have for this requirement to help determine if you will be a
candidate for a call back.

(No Visa Sponsorship available and no 3rd party referrals or agencies for any
WSI Nationwide requirements, please). If you use E-mail (strongly preferred) to
respond, please e-mail your Word, RTF or Text resume with contact information,
address and phones, (no URL resume links or Zip files and please do not return a
copy of this announcement with your response) to Jay L., with the subject line
(or title and skills) of this message in the subject line of the message you
send, no job numbers only, please. (Those are assigned by the various websites,
and I don't know what the numbers refer to), thanks, at [email].
Qualified candidates will have clear English speaking skills and two years+ paid
USA experience.

If you know someone who might qualify, or is coming to the New York / NY, New
Jersey / NJ, Connecticut/ CT or Pennsylvania / PA area, (we have an additional
150+ open employment and consulting requirements for all of which no visa
sponsorship is available and no 3rd party referrals or agencies for any WSI
Nationwide requirements), please e-mail a Word, RTF or Text resume with contact
information, address and phones to Jay L., with the subject line of this message
in the subject line of the message you send, (no URL resume links and please do
not return a copy of this announcement with your response) at
[email] fax to 212-534-3724 or call 212-410-1400.

(To insure formatting & print quality, you may also mail a copy
to me at WSI Nationwide, Inc, 1619 Third Avenue, Box #6415, New York, NY
10128-0004).

A full listing of all WSI requirements can be seen at
http://www.wsinationwide.com

When resumes are received, the candidate is contacted if there is a
match, the situation is thoroughly described and the candidate tells
us how they would like us to proceed.  No information leaves our
office without prior approval. This creates long term relationships,
which we encourage.

WSI is a specialty recruiting organization with over twenty years
experience and fees paid by our selected client companies, freeing our
hands to find top level candidates for better projects all over the
USA.


author: Solaris Boy

subject: SPARC STORAGE ARRAY and RAID 5

text:
Hi..

I have some Q's regarding the SPARC STORAGE ARRAY. I looked up sun.com
and they dont have any info on this( Unless I am extremely bad at
browsing websites). All that I see on the storage part is SUN STOR
EDGE. Is this(SPARC STORAGE ARRAY) an antique now? (or) Can I still
use this to install solaris 9. Also We would like to do RAID5 on this.
Is this possible on this storage array? Is it a good idea to have HD's
manufactured by other vendors or go for HD's manufactured by SUN. I
guess they come in 18GB and 36GB.

T I A..


author: Darren Dunham

subject: Re: SPARC STORAGE ARRAY and RAID 5

text:
Solaris Boy <[email]> wrote:

Possibly.  Are there no part numbers?

Is it fiber or scsi?  How many drives go in it?

If it's just a JBOD (like a StorEdge multipak), it'll work fine.  If
it's one of the old fiber SSA machines, you need special hardware that
you might have trouble finding and even more trouble running to make it
work.

You're going to have to describe it better.  StorEdge is too generic.


author: Dennis Clarke

subject: Re: SPARC STORAGE ARRAY and RAID 5

text:
On Sun, 27 Apr 2003, Solaris Boy wrote:

  hello

  ok .. shoot

   yes.  It is EOL for a long time now.

   no problem.

  Really really _bad_ idea.  If you want world class slow performance then
  you can do RAID5 via SVM but ... don't do that to yourself. Just don't.

  Well .. 18Gb disks are definately not supported on the SSA.
  In fact, I don't think that you will get much more than a 4Gb Sun disk
  in that SSA within the definitions of Sun specs.  Outside of that you may
  be able to simple put 9Gb disks in there also.

  Be sure that you have ssaadm installed on the server.

  Thus :

# uname -a
SunOS medusa 5.9 Generic_112233-04 sun4u sparc SUNW,Ultra-2
# cat /etc/release
                           Solaris 9 s9_58shwpl3 SPARC
           Copyright 2002 Sun Microsystems, Inc.  All Rights Reserved.
                        Use is subject to license terms.
                             Assembled 15 April 2002
                     Solaris 9 Maintenance Update 2 applied

# which ssaadm
/usr/sbin/ssaadm

# ssaadm -v display c1
    - Getting state information from SPARCstorage Array
        /devices/sbus@1f,0/SUNW,soc@1,0/SUNW,pln@a0000000,78c6ac:ctlr
        - Verifying Controller is healthy
                Controller is a:SUN       SSA100
        - Reading state of each drive
        - Reading vendor's information and capacity from each drive

                    SPARCstorage Array 100 Configuration
                     (ssaadm version: 1.23 00/07/17)
Controller path:/devices/sbus@1f,0/SUNW,soc@1,0/SUNW,pln@a0000000,78c6ac:ctlr
                          DEVICE STATUS
      TRAY 1                 TRAY 2                 TRAY 3
slot
1     Drive: 0,0             Drive: 2,0             Drive: 4,0
2     Drive: 0,1             Drive: 2,1             Drive: 4,1
3     Drive: 0,2             Drive: 2,2             Drive: 4,2
4     Drive: 0,3             Drive: 2,3             Drive: 4,3
5     Drive: 0,4             Drive: 2,4             Drive: 4,4
6     Drive: 1,0             Drive: 3,0             Drive: 5,0
7     Drive: 1,1             Drive: 3,1             Drive: 5,1
8     Drive: 1,2             Drive: 3,2             Drive: 5,2
9     Drive: 1,3             Drive: 3,3             Drive: 5,3
10    Drive: 1,4             Drive: 3,4             Drive: 5,4

                          CONTROLLER STATUS
Vendor:        SUN
Product ID:    SSA100
Product Rev:   1.0
Firmware Rev:  3.12
Serial Num:    00000078C6AC
Accumulate Performance Statistics: Disabled

Thus, I have thirty disks in the SSA with ten in each tray.  Common sense
dictates that you can not simply create one large RAID5 stripe across all
thirty disks.  Why?  Well, in the event of a disk failure you will need to
take the entire array offline in order to spin down a tray and replace a
single disk.  The best way to setup things is to simply stripe an entire
tray together and then mirror that with its neighbor tray.  If you have all
three trays full then you can create a three-way mirror and do online backups
whenever you want by taking a tray offline.  So long as you don't lose a disk
in each tray you're fine.

Be sure to read the man page of the ssaadm utility.  You will need it.
The key thing to know is how to spin down a tray and replace a disk while
running.

Dennis


author: Joseph

subject: how to format hard disk

text:
anybody knows how to format hard disk with window xp?  I have a laptop
IBM with window xp, and I really want to format the hard disk
completely to install other old version window, please help.........


author: MackanHBG

subject: Re: how to format hard disk

text:
The easiest way should be to boot from a W98 start diskette. When DOS
has started type "format c:".


author: ray

subject: Re: how to format hard disk

text:
pressuming u want re-format the hdd n install some other OS u cant
format it thru XP (since that is ur native OS) pop in a bootbale dos
floppy woth fdisk.exe n format.com boot via the disk make sure uve got
a backup of ur drive
then
format c:

..thats about it ur ready with a spanking clean new hdd to use


author: Amina

subject: Re: how to format hard disk

text:
[email] (MackanHBG) wrote in message news:<[email]>...

put bootable win Xp cd in your cdrom. when the computer starts it will
ask you whether you want to start from the cdrom(like this....press
any key to continue booting from cd). once it is booted from cd you
can format your hard disk and you can create paritition either with
fat or ntfs.


subject: Re: how to format hard disk

text:
[email] (Amina) wrote in message news:<[email]>...

Hi, guys
Thanks for your help, however It still doesn't work, I made a ms dos
start up disk in floppy disk but it does not have the format files.  I
tried manually copy this file to my disk, but the windows won't let me
do it.  I don't have win 98 start up disk so I can't try to see if it
works.  the cd that Amina suggested, I did try however it won't
success.  I know for sure that if I can copy a format file then I can
do it.  Show me how to get that file.


subject: Re: how to format hard disk

text:
[email] (Amina) wrote in message news:<[email]>...

hi guys, finally I can format my hard disk by using win xp cd, thanks
Amina.  What I did is like Amina suggested, and at the window set up
promp, I pressed R for recovery consol then it tells me to select key
number for window to consol.  After that, it prompts for password of
Administator.  Typed pw, then it promps again, typed format C: then it
did it....Thanks all of you for your helps........


subject: panther with xpostfacto on wallstreet without OS 9

text:
Have : Wallstreet with Jaquar, 512ram,  300mgh,  h.d. 5 gig 1.9 free, can I
install Panther with Xpostfacto without OS9 on it ?

If so, will my macally usb card work?

Thanks.


author: [redacted]

subject: Re: panther with xpostfacto on wallstreet without OS 9

text:
In article <[email]>, S.Tos
<[email]> wrote:

The instructions say it runs in OS X, so try it and see.
If you can't get it to work, then in the following link, there are
instructions to install Panther without the help of OS 9, although
they're not for the faint hearted.

http://anybox.owc.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=166

Yes. Mine works fine.

Rob.


author: Rob Frohne

text:
In article <[email]>,
 "[email]" <[email]> wrote:

You won't be able to use all 512 Megs of RAM without suffering video
crashes though.  I still think the upgrade is worth it.

Rob


subject: Symantec C++ friends bug?

text:
1) I've got classes A, B, C, D, and E.
2) C, D, and E are sub-classes of B.
3) I want B, C, D, and E to be friends with A
   (and I have appropriate declarations in A).

Problem: compiler allows 'friend' declarations for B, C, D, and E,
but honors only B's declaration. I think because C, D, and E are
sub-classes of B that the compiler thinks it needs to enforce the
fact that friendship is not inherited, even though I explicitly
declare C, D, and E to be friends of A.

Can't find anything enlightening in ARM, can't find this sort of
behavior in the defect list.


author: John Werner

subject: Re: Symantec C++ friends bug?

text:
In article <[email]>, [email] wrote:

Can you post a code example?  It sounds like you're right, though.


author: Pete Gontier

subject: False alarm re: Symantec C++ friends bug

text:
[email] (John Werner) writes:

False alarm. My mistake. Caused by declaring C, D, and E in this style:

	class : public B { } C;

There are a zillion syntaxes for declaring classes and I have yet to
settle on the syntax which does what I expect. For example, what is
the difference between these two declarations?

	class C : public B { };
	typedef class C : public B { };

The first behaves as if it is a fully qualified type name. Whereas
if I did the same with a struct:

	struct C { short foo; };

...I would expect to have to declare it with:

	struct C c;

...rather than simply:

	C c;


subject: Re: False alarm re: Symantec C++ friends bug

text:
In article <[email]>, [email] (Pete Gontier)
wrote:

Is the second one legal?  I would think you'd use it to define a synonym
for class C, but there's none there.

Not in C++.  Both 'class C {};' and 'struct C {};' create C as a fully
qualified type name.  You never need to use 'struct C c' or 'class C c'.  I
think the only difference between declaring a struct and a class is that
all members of a struct are public by default.  Otherwise they're the same:
structs can have member functions, constructors, and so on.

The 'typedef struct C { ... } C;' syntax is (almost) never used in C++.  In
shared header files, you'll often see something like this:

  struct C {...};
  struct D {...};

  #ifndef __cplusplus
    typedef struct C C;
    typedef struct D D;
  #endif


text:
[email] (John Werner) writes:

Yep. I was using it for a while until I realized it was just reflex
and I hadn't seen anybody else do it. So I stopped.


author: Ethan Merritt

subject: Can one change the "default" X visual class?

text:
Here is the question -
	I am using a DECstation 5000/200PXG.  The Xtm server supports 7
visual classes; the default visual is 24-bit deep TRUECOLOR.  Now, is it
possible to have an X client see a different visual class as the default?
Can one, say, use xrdb to change which visual class is the default?  How
would that affect other clients which were already active?

Here is the problem -
	I am using FrameMaker as a WYSIWYG text+equations+figures
processor on a DECstation 5000/200PXG.  Most of it works fine, but there are
specific things which don't.  Notable among these are that the equations menu
and all imported graphics are invisible!  That is, the behaviour is about what
you would expect to see if the foreground and background were set to the same
colour.  This behaviour is specific to the DECstation display.  Using an X
terminal as a display device works fine.
	Frame technical support claims that the problem is that the PXG
has a default visual which is 24-bit TRUECOLOR, and their product (a) always
uses the default, and (b) can't handle the 24-bit depth.  Great programming.
Anyway, though they may fix this at some unspecified future date I would like
to find a work-around with what I've got.  I run other applications which
use the 24-bit TRUECOLOR visual (that is, after all, why I bought the machine
in the first place), so I would ideally like a work-around which doesn't
have nasty side-effects.

						Ethan A Merritt
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dept of Biological Structure                H510 Health Sciences
University of Washington SM-20              (206)543-8865
Seattle, WA 98195                           [email]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


author: Bob Heiney

subject: Re: Can one change the "default" X visual class?

text:
The Xtm X server takes "-class" followed by a visual type.  For example,
adding "-class PseudoColor" to the :0 line in your /etc/ttys entry like this:

:0 "/usr/bin/login -P /usr/bin/Xprompter -C /usr/bin/dxsession -e" none on secur
e window="/usr/bin/Xtm -su -bs -class PseudoColor"

This will make 8 plane PseudoColor the default visual type.  Unfortunately, however, this doesn't really solve your problem, since applications that expect a 24 plane visual will now break.

The only real solution is to encourage people to write code that either doesn't make bad assumptions about the visual type, or explicitly looks for the visual type it wants.

/Bob


author: Ken Lee

text:
|> 	Frame technical support claims that the problem is that the PXG
|> has a default visual which is 24-bit TRUECOLOR, and their product (a) always
|> uses the default, and (b) can't handle the 24-bit depth.

This is a major bug in their program.  They should read David
Rosenthal's visuals tutorial (in X11R4 and X11R5).

Many X servers allow you to change the default visual through a command
line option.  They probably require hat the default visual be
PseudoColor.


author: Rich Thomson

text:
In article <[email]>
	[email] (Ethan Merritt) writes:

Not in the stock sample server.  I imagine you could hack it in as an
extension, though it might be ugly :-).  The Athena widgets have a
"visual" resource that one can use to specify the visual for which the
window will be created, but I've noticed that there isn't code in
there to create a colormap for the window when the visual requires a
colormap other than the default colormap.

We faced the same problem and solved the issue with multiple, virtual
screens, each of which can be configured with a default visual from
one of the supported visuals in our server (24-bit TrueColor, 24-bit
DirectColor or 8-bit PseudoColor).  The number of screens and
default visual for each screen are selected at server startup time
with command-line options.

For instance, here's what my Xservers file says (its really all on one
line, but I've made it more readable by inserting backslashes and line
breaks):

    mesa:0.0 local /usr/bin/X11/Xesv -c \
	-nscreens 3x2 -pc8scr 1 -dc32scr 2 -stereotallscr 3 -stereoscr 4 \
	-co /usr/lib/X11/rgb/raveling

Meaning:

    -nscreens 3x2	Use 6 virtual screens in a 3 high by 2 wide array
    -pc8scr 1		Screen 1 has a default visual of 8-bit PseudoColor
    -dc32scr 2		Screen 2's default is 32-bit DirectColor (the
			red_mask, green_mask, and blue_mask fields
			indicate that only 24 of the 32 bits are significant)
    -stereotallscr 3	Screen 3 is in "tall stereo" (non 1:1 pixel
			aspect ratio video scanout) video mode
    -stereoscr 4	Screen 4 is a stereo screen

When no default visual is specified for a particular screen, the
default visual will be TrueColor.  So, screens 0, 3, 4, and 5 all have
a default visual of TrueColor.

For most brain-dead PseudoColor-oriented applications, running them on
a PC screen will be sufficient to get them to work properly.  However,
some are so brain-dead that regardless of what screen you are on (i.e.
mesa:0.1 for PseudoColor), they get "default" information from screen
0.  INGRES was a recent example of this kind of stupid assumption.
The solution is to restart the server with screen 0 having a PseudoColor
visual.  Then it worked.

No.

Yes, this is brain-dead programming on the part of any application
that is written this way.  However, I run Frame on my 24-bit TrueColor
ESV without any problems.  I haven't done much importing and exporting
of graphics, though.  I seem to remember that Frame complained that a
24-bit deep xwd dump "wasn't in xwd format"(!).

I would call customer support at Frame Technologies and complain very
loudly.  This kind of programming is much below the quality level that
I would expect from them.

						-- Rich


text:
In article <[email]>
[email] (Ethan Merritt) writes:
what

I believe there is a non-standard option to the X-Server that allows
you to specify the default visual.  I had to really poke around
to find it and now I have forgotten what it is.

Probably not what you wanted.  But as a last resort .....


author: Simpson

subject: Textwrap Problem

text:
Hi,

I'm wondering what would be the best way to approach this particular 'textwrap'
problem. It's a little out of the ordinary - at least, as far as I'm concerned -
since the 'text' being wrapped contains command characters that actually alter
the horizontal and vertical positions of the text at numerous points, creating
'doubled' lines.

The raw text I am attempting to squeeze into a nice neat column follows this
pattern:

greek words (english translation) greek words (english translation) greek words
. . .

eg.

Joh 1:1  en arche(in the beginning) hn(was) o logos(the word) kai(and) o
logos(the word) hn(was) prov(with) ton theon(God) kai(and) qeov(3 God) hn(2 was)
o logov(1 the word)

When the text is read into the text buffer, the width of each greek word / the
greek words (eg 'en arche') is calculated and the translation that follows
(enclosed in the
brackets, eg 'in the beginning') is positioned directly underneath them (moved
vertically down, horizontally backwards). So the Greek is unbroken and the
English translation of each word appears [in smaller type] directly underneath
the
Greek word.

The difficulty arises when the text is wrapped by a second routine. The method
is simple. SWI"Font_ScanString" is supplied a maximum width,
and it feeds back the position in the string to introduce the line break.The
textwrap
program registers the beginning of each new [wrapped] line in a separate memory
block (8 byte aligned: first 4 bytes contain address of line, second 4 bytes
contain initial font handle) and inserts line breaks (char13) into the text
block at the
appropriate points, so each line can be displayed directly using SWI
"Font_Paint".

Now if the Greek segment consists of more than one word (eg 'en arche'), it may
potentially be split across two lines. That in itself isn't a problem. The
difficulty is that
the translation ('in the beginning'), which sits directly underneath it, will
appear
in its entirety on the line below, because SWI "Font_ScanString" will have
introduced
a link break after the first word 'en'. SWI "Font_Paint" will then shift the
translation
backwards (out of view) when the line containing 'arche' is drawn.

- - - Example of data block being wrapped - - -

. . . en arche [move back and down]in the beginning[move up and forward] hn . .
.

line break occurs after 'en', 'arche' displayed on next line along with 'in the
beginning'

- - - End of example - - -

I'm not sure which is the best way to approach this.

I think any attempt to produce a secondary procedure to 'massage' the results of
the textwrap during redraw would be hideously messy.

I can't see how I would change the text wrap procedure to do the job properly
without it becoming rather unpleasant either. I suppose it would have to scan
ahead at the end of each line break position suggested by SWI "Font_ScanString"
and look for command chars that would effectively move a portion
of text backwards within acceptable parameters, scan to see how much of the text
would fit and splice that section of text just after the suggested line break...

- - - Example - - -

. . . en [suggested linebreak] arche [move back and down]in the beginning
[move up and forward] hn . . .

becomes

. . . en [move back and down]in [linebreak] arche [move back and down]
the beginning [move up and forward] hn . . .

- - - End of example - - -

Is there an easier way? Any nice neat suggestions?

Many thanks!

W.Simpson


author: Martin Dann

subject: Re: Textwrap Problem

text:
In message <O4Tx8.1931$[email]>
          "Simpson" <[email]> wrote:

Have you though about useing hard spaces to stop the phrase from being
split. e.g. en-arche(in-the-beginning) hn(was) o-logos(the-word)
where the - represents chr$&A0. Assuming that the font handling routines
can handle hard spaces.
I know that this is not ideal, but it is simple.

Martin.


author: Michael Curtis

subject: Re: Textwrap Problem

text:
In message <O4Tx8.1931$[email]>
 "Simpson" <[email]> wrote:

[snip]

How about this:
 array
  {
   {
    greek = "en arche"
    english = "in the beginning"
   },
   {
    greek = "hn"
    english = "was"
   }
  }

The program then goes through each array element and finds the length of both
the Greek and English segments.  Chosing the maximum of these two lengths for
each array, the program adds these lengths together with the length of a
space character until it leaps over the end of the line (backing off one when
this happens).  Now the number of array elements that fit on the line are
found.  The program plots these array elements using two seperate calls to
Font_Paint (one for the big, text, another for the small).

diagrammatically:
 ( | length of English word, : length of Greek word)
                                       \/ end of line here
 | en arche:         hn:  o logos:  kai: (back off to three elements)
 | in the beginning| was| the word| and|

start again
 | kai: o logos: ......
 | and| the word|

Hopefully this makes sense.


subject: Re: Textwrap Problem

text:
Hi,

"Martin Dann" <[email]> wrote in message
news:[email]...
may
will

Yes, I had thought about that one and was going to
try it out today (only my eyes need a break from
being glued to the monitor). It would work, but as you
say, it's not ideal as there are quite a few one-to-many
and many-to-one translations which will invariably
tend to erode the desired shape of the column.

However, since another voice has suggested it now,
I feel sufficiently confident to fall back on this if no other
nice solution pops up.

Cheers,

W.Simpson

- - -

Or bananas are 50-60% human. . . . does that make
skinning bananas criminal? ;-)

Perhaps, in another dimension, bananas are pulling humans out of the
trees by their tails, peeling them and eating them for snacks as they go
about their daily business.


subject: Re: Textwrap Problem

text:
Hi,

"Michael Curtis" <[email]> wrote in message
news:[email]...

I think so. It's a nicer, neater way of doing what my
routine would already be doing, I think, if I was to
substitute all spaces for hard spaces, except those
spaces that separate each Greek|English segment.

If I understand your suggestion, it solves the problem
by removing any segment-splitting at all, so only a whole
number of segments is displayed per line. The same effect
could be achieved with hard-spaces.

What I was originally wondering was whether I could
allow the Greek to be split, but at the same time manage
the splitting of the English segment as well across the
two lines, so you could have

line 1
...en [line    ]
...in  [break]

line 2
arche              hv ...
the beginning   was...

But I am thinking that keeping a whole number of elements
is best, despite the bumpy effect it will have on the shape of
the column, since the translation element of a many-to-many
segment could look confusing (and be misleading) if it were
split over two lines, for various reasons I won't go into here.

If I were to use hard spaces, I would anticipate the textwrap
routine to produce the following result.

Let '-' represent a hard space
Let 'L' equal the character position where the text has
exceeded the maximum width
Let 'Lb' equal the character position of the subsequent
line break

en-arche(in-the-beginning) hn-(was) ho-logos(the-word)...

When  1<=L<=8, Lb = 0
Also when  9<=L<=26, Lb =0

When  L = 27, Lb = 27

Since the whole segment is hard-spaced, it won't be split,
and since the English element contains the command chars
for horizontal motion, SWI "Font_ScanString" will take
this into account, decrementing its width counter as it
reaches the English element, and it won't prematurely announce
a line break.

Thank you for your suggestion.

I will have another go at this problem today.

Cheers,

W.Simpson


author: wogston

subject: GXP60 PIO WINXP

text:
Hello.

I have IBM GXP60 60 GB IBM Deskstar ATA drive, actually I have two of them,
in Primary IDE Channel (Windows XP Device Manager). Both have UDMA-5 enabled
(checked with FeatureTool from Hitachi website). From Device Manager,
however, other, Device 0 has Current Transfer Mode: PIO, while other (Device
1) has Ultra DMA Mode 5.

The Device 0 is the boot drive, and it's really slow, whenever HD access
takes place it freezes whole machine, literally (Pentium4 1.7Ghz on GB850
Intel chipset).

Any way to force or change settings so that the Device 0 would use Ultra DMA
Mode 5? The Transfer mode for both devices in Primary IDE Channel Properties
sheet is set to "DMA if available".

-W


author: Rod Speed

subject: Re: GXP60 PIO WINXP

text:
wogston <[email]> wrote in message
news:blmkuf$pkh$[email]...

Ah, the infamous DeathStars.

The NT/2K/XP family of OSs will do that if its seeing error with
a drive. It basically runs it like that for extra safety of your data.
Its arguable if that makes sense, but that the way it does things.

And thats the reason XP is running the drive in PIO mode, that problem.

You need to fix the fundamental problem,
the errors XP is seeing with the drive.

And since its a DeathStar, I'd personally toss them
both in the bin and replace them with better drives.

And its CRUCIAL that you backup whatever you will slash
your wrists if you lose BEFORE the drive dies completely.
Even if you have to run out and buy a cd burner to do that.

You might find that the problem will go away for a while
if you use DFT on the drive, do the most aggressive
molesting of the drive that DFT can do, lose all the data
on the drive in the process, and restore it from backup.
But its normally only a temporary fix with an IBM GXP drive.

They aint called DeathStars for nothing.


author: Svend Olaf Mikkelsen

subject: Re: GXP60 PIO WINXP

text:
On Sun, 5 Oct 2003 04:49:48 +1000, "Rod Speed" <[email]>
wrote:

As you know we have 1 somewhat reliable failure report for an 60GXP.

And that should be? As you know, we have more failure reports for
other brands.

Well, almost nothing is known about fatal and not fatal failure rates
for different brands.


subject: Re: GXP60 PIO WINXP

text:
Not when I bought them years ago, when the P4 1.7 was new.. I got two 250 GB
maxtors on TX2 on this machine, so I think I have room to move the files,
ditch the drive, sent to warranty, sell the replacement and get another
Maxtor.

Thanks, the explanation was quite clear ; I had no idea that XP would switch
to PIO if it finds problems with the drive.

-W


subject: Re: GXP60 PIO WINXP

text:
Svend Olaf Mikkelsen <[email]> wrote in
message news:[email]...

There's been a hell of a lot more than just one.

And IBM has had a hell of a lot more than one RMAed too.

Personally I prefer the WDs and Samsungs.

Bullshit.

More bullshit with IBM GXPs.


subject: Re: GXP60 PIO WINXP

text:
Svend Olaf Mikkelsen <[email]> wrote in
message news:[email]...

There's been a hell of a lot more than just one.

And IBM has had a hell of a lot more than one RMAed too.

Personally I prefer the WDs and Samsungs.

Bullshit.

More bullshit with IBM GXPs and Fujitsu MPGs particularly.


author: Pam

subject: firewalls and email

text:
I'm running xp pro with IE 6 and OE6 - I recently had a lot of problems with
ZA and retrieving emails thru my domain names (my isp is earthlink and I
have no problem getting email directly thru the earthlink addresses) - so I
finally deleted ZA - reset my computer to a previous restore point and was
able to get email. However...of course I think I needed some more
protection - so from reading hte threads it looked like kerio was a good one
to put on .. so did...worked fine and dandy for a couple days - now...when I
go get mail thru OE - I am getting my earthlink addresses ok, but the domain
names that I have set up with OE and earthlink, looks like it sends and
receives (email program is working, no errors) but there is no mail being
received. It WILL send an email and return it if I use a domain name to send
it and my earthlink address to send it to...(if that makes sense) ... I've
contacted my server where I host my websites, but havne't heard from them
yet.

would anyone know if this is  a server problem on my hosts end, or is this
an OE/Kerio problem?

thanks for any help!

Pam


author: darkog

subject: Re: firewalls and email

text:
"Pam" <[email]> wrote in
news:%pLQe.3295$[email]:

don't use windows firewall. it's a piece of junk!!!


author: Duane Arnold

subject: Re: firewalls and email

text:
"Pam" <[email]> wrote in
news:%pLQe.3295$[email]:

An error message from OE would be helpful.

Duane :)


author: Wolfgang Kueter

subject: Re: firewalls and email

text:
Pam wrote:

The reason for the problem is that you use a tool and neither

1. can clearly define why you use it
2. have understood the tool
3. have understood what the tool can do
4. have understood what the tool cannot do
5. have understood  why the tool is useless due to point 4

Uninstall it, use the XP-bullt-in packet filter if you believe you need one,
stop using insecure client software and stop using an account with admin
rights for normal work.

Wolfgang


author: Volker Birk

subject: Re: firewalls and email

text:
Pam <[email]> wrote:

Why not considering dropping Kerio also, and just using the Windows-
Firewall? I don't think, that you have more protection with a "Personal
Firewall" than with the Windows-Firewall.

But more problems.

Perhaps it will also be a good idea not to use IE and OE - there are
other software programs, under them even free and gratis ones, which are
as easy to use and don't have security design flaws like ActiveX, Active
Scripting or unfixed security holes for more than a year.

For example, you could use Opera, The Bat, or Mozilla Firefox and
Mozilla Thunderbird.

Also these programs have security problems from time to time, and you
should keep this software up to date. But this gives a level of safety
back to you.

Yours,
VB.


subject: Re: firewalls and email

text:
darkog <darkogAThushmailDOTcom> wrote:

The Windows-Firewall is configuration tool for the packet filter in the
Windows kernel.

Please explain, what is the problem with it.

Yours,
VB.


author: Bob Gibson

subject: Child process management

text:
I wrote a script to issue "rexec who" to one machine at a time.
In order to handle those cases where the partner machine isn't
responding, I added a SIGALRM handler.

  My question is related to the fact that within my script, I use
fork to isolate the child process, which may "hang" from the parent,
which I want to keep around.  Within the child, I use system() to
issue the rexec.

  My problem arises when the remote machine doesn't respond.  In
my SIGALRM handler, I wanted to kill the child process which is
hung.  However, the spawned process (i.e., the system() call) also
has to be killed.  Is there an easier way?

Thanks
Bob
==========
#!/bin/perl
#
#    Name: whoson
#
#   Usage: whoson number [number]*
#
#   Where: number is a whole number representing an existing lab machine
#
# Example: whoson 2 3 4 5
#
# Purpose: rexec "who" on the specified lab machine(s)
#
# Changes: 94-10-18 rag New
#

$SIG{ALRM}='Expire';

sub Expire {
# system( 'ps -ef | grep -E "whoson|rexec"' );
  $kids = "";
  open ( KIDS, "ps -ef | grep $child_pid |" ) || die "Can't use ps $!\n";
  while ( <KIDS> ) {
    @procs = split( " " );
    if ( ( $procs[ 1 ] == $child_pid ) |
         ( $procs[ 2 ] == $child_pid ) ) {
      $kids .= " ".$procs[1];
    }
  }
  close (KIDS);
# print "killing: $kids\n";
 `kill -9 $kids`;
  print "no response\n\n";
}

if ( $#ARGV == -1 ) {
  chop( $name = `basename $0` );
  print "$name - Determine who is using specified lab machine(s).\n";
  print "Usage: $name number [number ...]\n\n";
  print "Where: number if the number of a lab machine to be queried.\n\n";
  print "Example: $name 2 3 4 5\n";
  exit;
}

foreach (@ARGV) {
  if ( $_ =~ /^\d+$/ ) {               # Valid number?
    $lab = "lab" . substr( "0" . $_ , -2 );

FORK:
    alarm(5);
    if ( $child_pid = fork ) {         # Parent
      wait;
      alarm(0);
      $rv = $?;                        # $? contains the status
    } elsif (defined $child_pid ) {    # child
      print "Trying: rexec $lab who\n";
      system( "rexec $lab who" );
      print "\n";
      exit;
    } elsif ($! =~ /No more process/) {
      alarm(0);
      sleep 2;
      redo FORK;
    } else {                           # Wierd FORK error
      die "Can't fork: $!\n";
    }

#   print "After fork:\n";
#   system( 'ps -ef | grep -E "whoson|rexec"' );

  } else {
    warn "\'$_\' is not a number.\n";
  }
}


author: Cheshire Cat

subject: Re: Child process management

text:
Captain's log entry <[email]> by Bob Gibson:
:   My problem arises when the remote machine doesn't respond.  In
: my SIGALRM handler, I wanted to kill the child process which is
: hung.  However, the spawned process (i.e., the system() call) also
: has to be killed.  Is there an easier way?

Hmm, if you are simply spawning a child to do "rexec who", why not use the
exec() call instead of the system() call?  The exec() replaces the child
process completely, so killing the child effectively kills off the hung "who"
process.


author: David J. Kernen

subject: Re: Child process management

text:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

On Wed, 19 Oct 1994, Bob Gibson wrote:

	Yes, instead of doing a system(), do an exec(), which will turn
the child process into a rexec command without the implicit fork. i.e.:

] #      system( "rexec $lab who" );     Take out these two lines &
] #      print "\n";			  replace w/
	exec("rexec $lab who ; echo " );
Hope this helps!
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------
[email]   	        David J. Kernen
[email]                     Dept. of Information Systems
[email]                      Thomas Jefferson University
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: 2.6

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RjAv4NJpp8ke3cXSeJl6Enj6JvWezmpi6a4uYbvKKUeYrIynObJ6kHlDRzZGou6C
xpDyo03pFcs=
=vm2/
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----


author: Fringe Ryder

subject: Re: HI-VAL at compUSA any good?

text:
"Arny Krï¿½ger" <[email]> sez:

Tyan?  No, you just don't know the market very well.  Tyan is a major vendor
of motherboards, not of end-user systems.  You really leap a bit too quickly.

It's true I've been looking at only the top-end ones.  I apparently also
haven't been looking at particularly competitive sources... in response to
your message, I pulled out Computer Shopper, and the first ad that listed CPU
prices was less than my statement.  PII-300 at $859, 233 at $599.  Flip side
is that the P233MMX is $339, a lot less.  So I was wrong on that one, although
my sources did have them closer to $1000.

You should learn from this though - I look up and support my statements, and I
try to verify yours.  You should try to verify yours sometimes too, since so
many have been so far off.  For example, look through Computer Shopper and see
if you can find any motherboards without any ISA slots.

Good luck.

--- To reply, remove the nospam from my 'From:' line ---


author: Steven R. Gerber

text:
To All:
Please help. I did check with OpenBSD.org -- No luck ...
I would really like to use this card with my HP NetServer E40.
Driver Request: HP NetServer 10/100TX PCI LAN Adapter (D5013A)

Thanks,
Steven


author: Peter N. M. Hansteen

subject: Re: Driver Request: HP NetServer 10/100TX PCI LAN Adapter (D5013A)

text:
"Steven R. Gerber" <[email]> writes:

Did you try simply booting off the installer images to see if it
gets recognized and used?


text:
You've opened my eyes! Thank you!
Now, if I could get DHCP fixed ...
I seem to be getting a bad Broadcast address from some unknown DHCP server.

Steven

Peter N. M. Hansteen wrote:


author: Berk S. Daemon

text:
"Steven R. Gerber" <[email]> wrote in message
news:[email]...
server.

Just manually set the broadcast address, or modify /etc/dhclient.conf
accordingly. But, unknown DHCP server???


author: David Masterson

subject: Shell portability problems with $*

text:
WOW!  This was unexpected...

For the following simple_shell:

#! /bin/sh
uname -a
echo "1 - Argument list = $*"
shift
echo "2 - Argument list = $*"
cat > simple_shell2.sh <<'EOF'
#! /bin/sh
echo "A - Argument list = $*"
EOF
chmod 0755 simple_shell2.sh
. simple_shell2.sh testing
echo "3 - Argument list = $*"
exit 0

when I run it the following way:

$ simple_shell a b c d

I get the following output on Solaris:

SunOS xyzzy 5.7 Generic_106541-12 sun4u sparc SUNW,Ultra-80
1 - Argument list = a b c d
2 - Argument list = b c d
A - Argument list = b c d
3 - Argument list = b c d

and I get the following output on AIX:

AIX xyzzy 3 4 000784354C00
1 - Argument list = a b c d
2 - Argument list = b c d
A - Argument list = testing
3 - Argument list = testing

and I get the following output on Windows-NT (MKS ksh):

Windows_NT xyzzy 4 00 586
1 - Argument list = a b c d
2 - Argument list = b c d
A - Argument list = testing
3 - Argument list = testing

and I get the following output on Linux (RH6.2 bash):

Linux xyzzy 2.2.14-7.1.0mvfssmp #1 SMP Mon Jul 16 11:40:29 PDT 2001 i686 unknown
1 - Argument list = a b c d
2 - Argument list = b c d
A - Argument list = testing
3 - Argument list = b c d

Two questions:

* Who's right?  (only Linux looks correct)
* Can the shell script be written more portably?


author: Dan Mercer

subject: Re: Shell portability problems with $*

text:
In article <wBRN7.7957$[email]>,
"Bruce Adler" <[email]> writes:

This is true only for the Bourne shell.  All other descendent
shells support the passing of args.  If you are interested in
writing a portable script,  however,  you should avoid passing
args.


author: Bill Pemberton

subject: Re: Shell portability problems with $*

text:
In article <[email]>,
David Masterson  <[email]> wrote:

/bin/sh on Solaris is Bourne Shell, /bin/sh on AIX 4 and greater is
Korn Shell, so yes, they act differently.

On AIX, replace all your referecence to /bin/sh with
/bin/bsh and you'll get the same results as Solaris (or replace
/bin/sh with /bin/ksh on the Solaris side and it'll act the same as on
AIX).

Well, they're 3 different shells, so they're all right.

In my opinion, using Perl for the script is the best way to get there.


author: Steve Bellenot

subject: Re: Shell portability problems with $*

text:
In article <[email]>,
David Masterson  <[email]> wrote:

If you want the linux behavior on solaris, you can run this command
like
./simple_shell2.sh testing

Reading this statement from
http://www.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/7908799/xcu/chap2.html#tag_001_014_004
implys that this could be a valid way to read this standard.


author: Bruce Adler

subject: Re: Shell portability problems with $*

text:
"David Masterson" <[email]> wrote in message news:[email]...

They're all correct because you've got a bug in your script.
There's no exact definition of what the shell does if you
don't give it correct input. The only way Linux is correct
is if the Linux geeks have rewritten sh's specification of
how the "dot" command is supposed to work.

The bug in your script is on this line:

    . simple_shell2.sh testing

The "dot" command only expects a single "filename" arg. There's not
supposed to be any additional args after the filename. Change
that line to read:

    . simple_shell2.sh

and re-run your tests. And then change it to:

    set -- testing
    . simple_shell2.sh

and re-run your tests.


author: Geoff Clare

subject: Re: Shell portability problems with $*

text:
[email] (Dan Mercer) writes:

That's a rather sweeping statement.  "Some" or "many" other shells,
true, but *all* other descendent shells I doubt very much.

POSIX does not require the "dot" command to support additional args,
so I think it's quite likely that there is a bare-bones POSIX shell
around which does not support them.  Perhaps the FreeBSD one?

Yes indeed.


author: Chris F.A. Johnson

subject: Re: Shell portability problems with $*

text:
On 5 Dec 2001, Geoff Clare wrote:

It is supported by /bin/sh in FreeBSD :
FreeBSD ... 4.2-STABLE FreeBSD 4.2-STABLE #0: Fri Feb 16 17:23:16 EST 2001
but not NetBSD:
NetBSD ... 1.5.2 NetBSD 1.5.2 (SDF) #1: Mon Sep 24 21:08:36 UTC 2001 alpha


subject: Re: Shell portability problems with $*

text:
Hmmm.  I see what you mean.  I confused Bourne with POSIX/KSH syntax
(POSIX/Ksh does allow arguments after the filename).  Since there
appears to be no standard for what "/bin/sh" is, the different systems
put different shells there (Bourne, Posix, Bash) and the Bourne ones
ignored the arguments.  This was the first time I'd really tested the
portability of this capability -- my previous shells were probably
lucky (right system or no side-effects problem).

I'll experiment with that.  Thanks.


author: J.D. Stevens

subject: Re: Sun Sparc/sunOS 4.1.3 as SLIP/PPP client (not server):

text:
AlgoNet Kontakt writes:

I use c-slip that I got off the net on a Sparc IPX and Sparc 10, each running SunOS 4.1.3_U1.  It works very well dialing from either direction.  I use "expect" scripts to establish connections.  I keep a machine on the net all the time through a slip connection.  I use scripts to check the connection every 20 minutes.  Sometimes it goes days without breaking down and other times it breaks several times in a day, but the reconnect is automatic.

It can be done!  Drop email to me for additional information.

Dave


author: J Cravens

subject: cleaning the iBook screen

text:
I really need to clean the screen on my iBook (lots of fingerprints).
I've looked all through the literature that came with it, but I don't
see anything about do's and don'ts for cleaning the screen (except one
reference that says I should follow Apple's recommendations when
cleaning my iBook -- but I don't see any recommendations!).  I'm afraid
to even wipe it down, for fear of screwing it up.

Advice? do's and don'ts?


author: Leon C Pereira PhD

subject: Re: cleaning the iBook screen

text:
Try KlearScreen. Search the Web. Pidrus is one source.

I use it. Its good!


author: Ulf Scherov

subject: Re: cleaning the iBook screen

text:
J Cravens wrote:

I use a slightly damp microfiber cloth, works great. Just use any soft
lintfree material, slightly dampened with water. That ought to do it.

Ulf


author: Jeffrey P. Kempster

subject: Re: cleaning the iBook screen

text:
Here is apples opinion...

http://til.info.apple.com/techinfo.nsf/artnum/n60446

J Cravens <[email]> wrote in message
news:[email]...
fingerprints).
don't
one
afraid


author: [redacted]

subject: Disable a form submission link during validation?

text:
Assume there's a form with it's action attribute all set to post to a
URL, but without a submit control. Form submission is done via a link
and I want to prevent the classic "double submit". Ignoring the server
side of things, does anyone see any holes with the following script? It
seems to work, but I'd appreciate other eyes on it. Maybe a
try/catch/finally wrapper of some sort to be sure the link is
re-enabled in the face of an exception. I understand there are (many)
other ways to do this (e.g. temporarily "remove" the link), but I'm
mostly curious about the
this.onclick=falseFn/this.onclick=arguments.callee combo and any
potential gotchas. Thanks.

function falseFn() {
  return false;
}

// this is the onclick handler for the link
function submitLinkOnclick() {
  this.onclick = falseFn; // disable link to prevent double-submit

  var isOkToSubmit = false;
  var form = document.getElementById("form");

  // logic to see if it's OK to submit form (set isOkToSubmit = true)

  if (isOkToSubmit) {
    form.submit();
  } else {
    alert("blah blah blah");
    this.onclick = arguments.callee; // re-enable link
  }

  return false;
}


author: RobG

subject: Re: Disable a form submission link during validation?

text:
[email] wrote:

Two: if the user has JavaScript disabled or not available, they can't
submit the form.

The second (and probably bigger one) is that script execution on the
client is unreliable. You may end up with the form being submitted
multiple times anyway, or the user's first attempt to submit may not
work or be cancelled and your script may block subsequent submissions
unreasonably.

In order for 'this' to refer to the element on which the onclick
handler has been placed, you must be attaching the function dynamically
using something like:

   theLink.onclick = submitLinkOnclick;

I'm not a big fan of having an element with an ID the same as the tag
name, then also having a local variable with the same name - what
'form' refers to starts to get confusing.  IE will add a 'form'
property to the global object too.

Since you changed isOkToSubmit to false above, this will always return
false and the form will never submit.

So you will always re-set the onclick to the current function.  At what
point were you going to set it to falseFn?

The whole approach seems flawed.  If you want to try something on the
client, put a submit button in the form and have a global variable (or
the value of some hidden form field) set to 'not submitted' (or false
or whatever).  When the form is submitted, check the value to determine
whether to submit the form or not and change the value of the
variable/field to 'submitted' (or true or whatever). The following
example uses the form name to add a property to a global object so you
can keep track of multiple forms:

  <script type="text/javascript">

  var submittedForms = {};

  function checkSubmit(formRef){
    if (formRef.name in submittedForms){
      alert('submitted');
      return false;
    }
    submittedForms[formRef.name] = true; // Any value will do
  }
  </script>

  <form name="formA" action=""
   onsubmit="return checkSubmit(this);">
    <!-- rest of form -->.
    <input type="submit">
  </form>

But it's not a very reliable method of stopping multiple submissions.


text:
Rob,

Thanks for looking it over. See inline.

RobG wrote:

Sure, understood.

I'm not sure I follow. In what way is script execution unreliable? Do
you just mean that JavaScript could be disabled? Under what conditions
would the form be submitted multiple times?

Right.

Neither am I, it was just something quick to type for the example.

The comment was supposed to indicate that there would be logic in the
"real" function to determine if it's OK to submit the form.

It's the first thing that the function does.

I don't have the option of replacing the link with a form control to do
the submission. In terms of preventing multiple submissions via the
link, do you see any technical issues with the
this.onclick=falseFn/this.onclick=arguments.callee combo?


text:
Randy Webb wrote:

Disabled or not supported doesn't seem to be a concern for this app.
Not my call, just the reality of how the app is being developed for its
target environment. My only real concern is the implementation of the
submitLinkOnclick function. Assuming that the function is actually
invoked, are there any technical issues with it? I haven't come across
the approach of using this.onclick = falseFn/this.onclick =
arguments.callee to disable a link during processing, so I'm curious
about whether it's actually viable. One issue I can imagine, as noted
in the original post, is that it might make sense to use
try/catch/finally so that the link is re-enabled in case an exception
is thrown during the validation logic.

I suppose I could have used something like:

isOkToSubmit = validateForm(form);

without supplying the details of the validateForm function, but other
than that, the example actually is pretty close to the real code.


author: Randy Webb

text:
[email] said the following on 7/26/2006 8:44 AM:

<snip>

The user could have it disabled, it could not be present at all (my
cellphone doesn't support JS), or, an error in the code of the page
could cause JS to stop executing.

That is one of the flaws of "typing an example" whereby the code that is
being reviewed isn't even close to a real example's code.


author: Tobias Hofmann

subject: Re: How good is Win NT Resource Kit????

text:
Don Murdoch <[email]> wrote:

Well Don,

there is one topic I have always been clueless about:

Imagine you have a backup of a drive (e.g. small server, only one
drive...), which has headcrashed or something.
The backup contains (since you fidled around with the backup help) also
the registry information.

What you need now is how to restore the server ASAP - do I install an NT
from scratch as to have a ntbackup, and then restore? Does restore then
restore also settings of files in use by the current system? and so
on...

What does it say there?

tobi


author: Iñaki Baz Castillo

subject: How to include a string into a regex comparison?

text:
Hi, I don't get solving the following issue (sure it's easy but I cannot do it):

valid_content_type      = "application/auth-policy+xml"
received_content_type = "application/auth-policy+xml;charset=ISO-8859-1"

received_content_type =~ /^application\/auth\-policy\+xml;?/
=> 0

received_content_type =~ /^#{received_content_type};?/
=> nil

How to fix it? Thanks a lot.


subject: Re: How to include a string into a regex comparison?

text:
2009/7/31 Iñaki Baz Castillo <[email]>:

Solved:

received_content_type =~ /^#{Regex.escape(received_content_type)};?/
=> 0


author: F. Senault

text:
Le 31 juillet ï¿½ 11:25, Iï¿½aki Baz Castillo a ï¿½crit :

When you insert a string inside a regexp, it's evaluated as is by the
regexp engine.  You need to escape the special characters (here, the +),
by prepending backslashes or asking the Regexp class to do it for you :

=> 0

Or :

=> "application/auth\\-policy\\+xml"
=> 0

Fred


author: Jesús Gabriel y Galán

text:
On Fri, Jul 31, 2009 at 11:25 AM, Iñaki Baz Castillo<[email]> wrote:

Try this:

irb(main):001:0> valid_content_type      = "application/auth-policy+xml"
=> "application/auth-policy+xml"
irb(main):002:0> received_content_type =
"application/auth-policy+xml;charset=ISO-8859-1"
=> "application/auth-policy+xml;charset=ISO-8859-1"
irb(main):005:0> re = /^#{Regexp.escape(valid_content_type)};?/
=> /^application\/auth\-policy\+xml;?/
irb(main):006:0> received_content_type =~ re
=> 0

Hope this helps,

Jesus.


text:
On Fri, Jul 31, 2009 at 11:34 AM, Iñaki Baz Castillo<[email]> wrote:

Oh, sorry, I missed you already solved it. Anyway I wanted to point
out that maybe what you want in the Regex.escape is valid_content_type
not received_content_type...

Jesus.


text:
El 31 de julio de 2009 11:45, Jesús Gabriel y
Galán<[email]> escribió:

Thanks to all, the fact is that I already solved the issue doing
exactly the same :)
I replied to myself in the maillist.

Thanks a lot for all your help.


text:
El 31 de julio de 2009 11:46, Jesús Gabriel y
Galán<[email]> escribió:

Oh yes, sure, it was a typo just in the mail, in my code I did it correctly :)

Thanks a lot.


author: Don Harrison

subject: Universal Virtual Machine

text:
D. Erway writes:

:>>>>> "joc" == Connor  <James> writes:
:
: joc> 	I don't know Eiffel well enough to comment, but I have the same
: joc> feelings for Smalltalk.  Java, the language, is realtively unimpressive
: joc> to me.  The JVM as a universal byte code interpreter, I think, is very
: joc> powerful.  My weapon of choice is IBM Smalltalk and IBM is working on
: joc> their Smalltalk compiler to compile to JVM bytecode.  If I can write in
: joc> Smalltalk and execute on a JVM, I can have all my cake and eat it too.

Yes, having your cake and eating it too aptly describes the situation of
developing in a better language (than Java), but targeting the JVM. This
approach (not surprisingly) has been widely recognised and many language
implementers are going down that path. It shows you don't *have* to use
Java as your development language.

So, if you don't *have* to develop in Java, do you *have* to use the JVM?..

:I only wish it were true that the JVM were a universal byte code interpreter.
:But I know for sure it cannot handle, (without an unacceptable amount of
:interpretation), multiple dispatch.  I'm not even too sure about handling true
:multiple inheritance.  Anyone?

I haven't an answer to your question but, rather, would like to step back and
ask a different question. :) namely

  "What do you do when the the JVM doesn't provide adequate support for
   the language targeting it?"

There is a presupposition among many that you *must* target the JVM. If we
forget about commercial considerations for the moment and focus on technical
issues, we can see that it is not only unnecessary but probably undesirable
to target a VM tailored for a specific and arguably deficient language.

In theory, there is nothing to stop someone coming up with a Universal Virtual
Machine which provides an efficient target for a whole range of OO languages
including Eiffel, Smalltalk, Ada, Dylan etc. and, dare I say it, ... even Java.

Further, such a language could be supported by processor specifically designed
for it - a UVM chip analogous to Sun's Java chip. The obvious benefit would
be that users of the UVM wouldn't be tied in to a specific, possibly sub-optimal
architecture. Any chip manufacturer could make them so long as they adhered
to the specification which could be controlled by an "open" consortium.

Is anyone aware of any initiatives in this direction?

Don.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Don Harrison             [email]


author: Thomas

subject: error pinning a package

text:
13:38:39 SQL> show user
USER is "SYS"
13:38:50 SQL>  execute dbms_shared_pool.keep('SYS.STANDARD','P');
BEGIN dbms_shared_pool.keep('SYS.STANDARD','P'); END;

      *
ERROR at line 1:
ORA-06550: line 1, column 7:
PLS-00201: identifier 'DBMS_SHARED_POOL.KEEP' must be declared
ORA-06550: line 1, column 7:
PL/SQL: Statement ignored

Elapsed: 00:00:00.00


author: Howard J. Rogers

subject: Re: error pinning a package

text:
On 9 Aug 2004 13:40:02 -0700, Thomas <[email]> wrote:

Try running catspool.sql first. Found in the usual place: Oracle_Home,
rdbms, admin.

Needed to create DBMS_SHARED_POOL.

Regards
HJR


author: Daniel Morgan

subject: Re: error pinning a package

text:
Howard J. Rogers wrote:

dbmspool.sql ... and for information on this package go to:
http://www.psoug.org
click on Morgan's Library
click on DBMS_SHARED_POOL


author: Rene Nyffenegger

subject: Re: error pinning a package

text:
In article <[email]>, Howard J. Rogers wrote:

IMHO, that would be dbmspool.sql. Neither 9iR2, nor 10g have a
catspool.sql (at least not on my system).

Rene


subject: SUMMARY: Motif/Windows GUI class libraries. Results of my search so far

text:
Note: not all groups are received at this site. Please respond by email.

Well, I have been looking for Multi-OS GUI class libraries. And I must say, not
much has come up. I was looking for OL/Motif stuff and for Motif/Windows stuff
(for 2 different projects)

Zapp and Zinc - Already ruled out by customer (for different reasons).

Open Interface - Not a class library. The builder is a code generator (probably
stubs) so maintenance will be a problem.

Object Interface - Not available on Windows

Interviews - There seems to be a port of IV to Wind 3.1, but that was 2.6 and
besides, the people mentioned seem to be on vacation.

wxWindows - Looks promising, but some important stuff is missing, like
scrollable panels. The author seems to be on vacation. This is so far the most
likely candidate.

All who reacted: thanks.


author: Bob Weissman

subject: Re: SUMMARY: Motif/Windows GUI class libraries. Results of my search so far

text:
In article <[email]>,
 <[email]> wrote:

Try Galaxy/C++ from Visix Corp. in Reston, Virginia, USA.  It's a portability
class library which works on all the platforms you mentioned.

Try mailing to [email] for more information.


author: Robin P. Dunn

text:
In <[email]>, [email] writes:

I have looked at StarView from a company in Germany called Star
Division as part of an evaluation.  They have what looks like a fairly
good GUI class library that supports Windows, Mac, Motif, and OS/2.  I
havn't used it much yet because of time constraints with other
projects, but it seemed a little simpler to learn and use than zApp
for example.

Here is the company info from the README file...

EUROPA:

STAR DIVISION GmbH
StarView-Support
Sachsenfeld 4
20097 Hamburg

Telefon:    040 / 23 646 - 740
Fax:        040 / 23 646 - 550
E-Mail :    [email]

USA:

STAR DIVISION Corp.
StarView
2180 Sand Hill Rd. #320
Menlo Park, CA 94025

Telefon:    (415) 233 0140 / 1-800-888 8527
Fax:        (415) 233 0142
E-Mail :    [email]

PLEASE NOTE: As of today I have still not received the English
translation of the 2.0 documentation.  I have had to use the 1.0 docs,
(Which are not too bad.)
                                         ///
                                         o o
-------------------------------------oOO-(_)-OOo--------------------------
Robin P. Dunn, Software Engineer|                  |...!uunet!code3!robind
3M Health Information Systems   | Kilroy?  Who the |      [email]
H.I.M. Product Development      | he** is Kilroy?  |        (801) 265-4820

                                         ///
                                         o o
-------------------------------------oOO-(_)-OOo--------------------------
Robin P. Dunn, Software Engineer|                  |...!uunet!code3!robind
3M Health Information Systems   | Kilroy?  Who the |      [email]
H.I.M. Product Development      | he** is Kilroy?  |        (801) 265-4820


subject: Re: -> The Textures Gallery UPDATED !!! <-

text:
Patrick Brassil wrote:

Free High Rez Texture maps.
No cookie
No addie
No crashie
http://www.rs3art.com/texture/texture.htm
rs3


author: TaliesinSoft

subject: All Of A Sudden Applications Would Not Launch

text:
Early today, and all of a sudden, I could not launch a number of
applications, Microsoft Word and Excel, and Adobe InDesign, Photoshop, and
Acrobat. It didn't matter whether the attempted launch was by clicking on the
application icon, clicking on an associated document, using "Open With", or
using QuickSilver as a launcher. Shutting down the computer (MacBook Pro
running OS X 10.4.8) and restarting didn't help. This was attempted several
times. I then opted to restore things from a SuperDuper! backup made in the
middle of the night. After the restoration everything returned to normal and
has remained so since. Any ideas as to what went wrong?


author: Jolly Roger

subject: Re: All Of A Sudden Applications Would Not Launch

text:
On 2007-01-18 23:52:48 -0600, TaliesinSoft <[email]> said:

Not without examining the system and console logs, etc.


author: Gregory Weston

text:
In article <[email]>,
 TaliesinSoft <[email]> wrote:

All things that run under Rosetta, I believe?

If it happens again open a terminal and type (sans quotes) 'sudo killall
translated' and enter an admin password when prompted.

What "things" did you restore? All things, or a bit less destructive
than that?


text:
On Fri, 19 Jan 2007 00:26:18 -0600, Jolly Roger wrote (in article
<2007011900261882220-jollyroger@nullorg>):

As for satisfying curiosity as to what happened, the logs and such were wiped
out when the restoration from the backup was made. So, I guess things will
remain a mystery.


text:
On Fri, 19 Jan 2007 06:17:40 -0600, Gregory Weston wrote (in article
<[email]>):

The restoration was made by booting from the backup volume and then "backing
up" from that volume onto the internal drive. That caused the internal drive
to be a logical clone of the backup volume. It is though I stepped back in
time, undoing any changes to the internal drive that had been made subsequent
to the backup.


author: mau wong

subject: Fys's $199 Linux 1.3 Box

text:
Fys's is selling a $199 Linux 1.3 Box.

Do you know if it is compatable to the latest Caldera and Redhat, including
the modem and NIC?

Thank you


author: RusH

subject: Re: Fys's $199 Linux 1.3 Box

text:
begin  mau wong  napďż˝odziďż˝(a):

what is Fys ?

Pozdrawiam.


author: David E Fox

subject: Re: Fys's $199 Linux 1.3 Box

text:
RusH wrote:

I guess the OP means "fry's" as in Fry's electronics. It's an electronic/computer superstore chain in the US that tends to sell return to stock material as "new".


author: James Duncan

subject: Re: Fys's $199 Linux 1.3 Box

text:
On Sun, 03 Mar 2002 12:25:34 -0800, David E Fox
<[email]> wrote:

Probably at least 25% of their shelf inventory is repacks. Sometimes
it gets repacked several times before they'll pull it out of
circulation - they have been required to put stickers on the repacks.

Anyone attempting to buy a $199 "Linux special" machine at Fry's will
be subjected to intense upsell and pressured to buy missing items at
often full list.


author: Steve

subject: Re: Fys's $199 Linux 1.3 Box

text:
On Sun, 03 Mar 2002 22:50:22 GMT, James Duncan <[email]>
wrote:

No kidding.  Most of their inventory is RETURNS.  I purchased a Soyo
P4S Dragon Ultra with a P-IV 1.7ghz and when I checked out they tried
to pawn off on me a RETURNED processor.

Avoid FRY's at all costs.

Steve


author: The Real Bev

subject: Re: Fys's $199 Linux 1.3 Box

text:
James Duncan wrote:

You just have to be willing to drive back if it doesn't work.  If a sale-price
item works out of the box, you're generally way ahead of the game.  If it
doesn't, it's a nuisance and a waste of gas money.  Still, we buy way more
stuff from Fry's (minimum drive 18 miles 1 way) than at Best Buy, a short walk
across the street.

Maybe you just look like an easy mark :-)  I've never been pressured by a
Fry's person to buy more, and they've frequently been extremely helpful.
Their regular prices are nothing special, but you have to go to one of the
computer swap meets to do significantly better.

Besides, they're fun.