author: Sead Doric

text:
To get nice round spot you will probably need one optical system to
couple LED into multimode fiber and then on the other end of fiber to
have optical system that will collimate the fiber and then focuss it to
film.

You did not mentioned wavelength and working distance to the film.
Needless to say we do manufacture some LED to fiber devices. Typical
size of the LED to fiber pigtail that we make is like half of the laser
pointer.

Sead Doric

www.doriclenses.com

Algebra wrote:


author: Sam Goldwasser

subject: Re: Focusing an LED to produce a 85um spot

text:
RE: Pinhole and microscope optics.

Keep in mind that not very much light is going to get through the pin hole.
You didn't say how much light is required but using a cheap Far East import
laser pointer as the source would definitely get you both the spot size
and plenty of light.  Since they don't have any power regulator, you can
vary the intensity using a variable power supply in place of the batteries.
The only additional part would be a lens to focus the beam - that can be
a mircoscope objective or almost any short focal length positive lens.

In fact, the problems here may be too small a spot and too much intensity!

But, is $2 too expensive? :)

--- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ Home Page: http://www.repairfaq.org/
 Repair | Main Table of Contents: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/
+Lasers | Sam's Laser FAQ: http://www.repairfaq.org/sam/lasersam.htm
        | Mirror Site Info: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/F_mirror.html


author: [redacted]

text:
Steve J. Noll <[email]> wrote:

Siemens produces IR LEDs which are just SMD chips, without any optics.
The emitting surface is pretty small (about 0.2x0.2mm), so reducing it
by a projection with a simple lens to the required size shouldn't be
difficult. The product code is SFH400 or something like that.

Hope it helps.
-------------------------------------------------
Frank Hrebabetzky	Tel.:     +55 / 48 / 9998 7686
Florianopolis		email:	  [email]
Brazil


text:
"Algebra" <[email]> writes:

4 mm usually.

Which is what the optics in a laser pointer combined with your 4 mm lens
will do nicely.  For your spot size, the focusing lens could be a lot longer
focal length and that may be more convenient.

Yes.

Absolutely.  What do you require in the way of control over brightness?
It sounds like you at least want to turn it on and off.

--- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ Home Page: http://www.repairfaq.org/
 Repair | Main Table of Contents: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/
+Lasers | Sam's Laser FAQ: http://www.repairfaq.org/sam/lasersam.htm
        | Mirror Site Info: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/F_mirror.html


author: Scrim

text:
"Sam Goldwasser" <[email]> wrote in message
news:[email]...
would
the
there
Diode,
in
can.
hole.
import
batteries.
A cheap and easy way to get a nice small spot:
Get two identical laser pointers, strip the lens out of one and fix it to
the front of the other pointer ( get this added lens the right way round:
the side that used to be nearest the diode should now furthest from it).
I havn't measured anything, but it certainly puts a good percentage of the
light into a very small fiber.
As You say Sam, the problem may be too small a spot.
Re: Intensity variation: Is Scott concerned about non linear variation in
diode intensity with current perhaps?

Scrim


text:
"Scrim" <[email]> writes:

Well, I guess he can always defocus it.

Maybe but a laser diode operated above threshold current (It) will be quite
linear in power versus (current-It)

--- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ Home Page: http://www.repairfaq.org/
 Repair | Main Table of Contents: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/
+Lasers | Sam's Laser FAQ: http://www.repairfaq.org/sam/lasersam.htm
        | Mirror Site Info: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/F_mirror.html


subject: Some thoughts about the electrical field

text:
Hi
I have been lately rethinking some of the basics of electricity.
(Outrageous, yes…. but I can’t stop myself.)
It occurred to me that there is something wrong with the classical
picture of two interacting electrical charges which says:
“Let’s consider two electrically charged particles having  the same
kind of electricity.
One of the particles creates a force-field , which then acts on a
second  particle and  pushes  it from its current position, toward an
area of the field where the field is LESS stronger than in the
current
position.
If the particles are of opposite charges, then each particle is
pushed
by the field created by the other one, from its current position
toward  the field area with a HIGHER intensity of the field”
Now, just think:
•     A charge creates a field
•     A second charge creates an electrical field as well
•     We presume that the action on a particle happens ON its surface
•     In the proximity of the second charge the properties of the
resulting field are given mainly by ITS OWN charge, no matter how
small that charge is
•     Nevertheless, this charged particle is pushed according to a
rule
which changes with the type of charge of the first particle (The”
field-maker”)
•     The same applies for the first charge
Doesn’t seem this an oversimplification?
In fact, what we should see here is a qualitatively different
picture:
•     The first charged particle creates an undefined (for now) change
in
the surrounding matter.(Note that, here I use the word “matter” as a
word for all physically detectable reality, like philosophers use it
in dialectical materialism!)
•     One may call this change: electrical field
•     The second charged particle creates the same way a change in
the
surrounding medium/matter/space   (choose the word you like and
ignore
the others).
•     Let us suppose here that both charges are positive
•     Near  the second body/particle both of the 2 influences are
felt
•     Same applies for the first particle
•     We observe that between the charges, the 2 fields are opposite,
while on the other side of them the 2 fields are of same effect.
•     We can say then for sure, that in the space area between the
charges, the combined influence of the two charges is less than in
the
outside space area (for simplicity, consider only points on the
straight line which goes through both particles)
•     THEN the 2 particles are pushed from a lower intensity
electrical
field-area toward a higher intensity field-area, which is exactly the
opposite of the usual way of understanding the phenomenon.
•     SURPRISINGLY, the very same conclusion results  for the case of
the
interaction of two opposite kind of electrical charges!
•     The conclusion from the above is that, if we take into account
the
influence of all the charges that create the resultant electrical
field, then all charged particles are acted upon the SAME way, no
matter what kind of electrical charge they have got : FROM A LOWER
INTENSITY FIELD AREA TOWARD A HIGHER INTENSITY FIELD AREA!
•     Again, not to forget: This conclusion is based on the idea that
in
reality what acts on a charged particle is NOT a particular
electrical
field but the field created by all participants,
the particle in question included!
Best regards, LL


author: Laszlo Lemhenyi

subject: Re: Some thoughts about the electrical field

text:
On Apr 23, 12:12 pm, "Szczepan Bialek" <[email]> wrote:

Let say, electrically charged particles or charged bodies where we dot
have
to discuss a particular spatial distribution of electrical charge.
Regards, LL


text:
On Apr 27, 12:49 pm, "Szczepan Bialek" <[email]> wrote:

You said: "In today's picture there is a deficit or excess of
electrons. "
Yes and no! Electrical charge is not  a property just of the
electrons.
Then, there is one more aspect to consider:
Even if the electrical charge is quantized, the behavior of a metalic
object with
1 electron in excess is, as if that charge would be distributed
continuously on its surface. (there is no spatial quantization is this
case)
And this is normal, as of course nobody
can tell WHICH electron is the surpluss one.
The same way,as far as I know, an electric current
through a conductor is NOT quantized. That means, IF we calculate
that
the intensity of the current corresponds to, let say, 5.4 electrons
passing through a
cross-section of the conductor at any moment of time, the meaning of
this
value is only a  statistical one.
Considering this, the idea of an electrical fluid has a similar
meaning
with the "statistical electrons" and may have the same usefulness for
computing purposses
      Anyway, I do not  think that it matters HOW the electrical
charge of
a microscopical or a macroscopical object is obtained, that is, adding
electrons,
removing electrons or by any other means.
I was talking about something else, which might not be liked by some
people, for it may bring up the subject of the aether again.
(At this point, it is not my intent to discuss it as well.)
What I have said,was: the idea of a force-field created by a charged
object is a good mathematical idea but a poor physical idea.
Then I have showed, that using another picture of what is happening,
we get another way of understanding an electrostatical interaction
 which is valid no matter what kind of charges have
two electrically interacting objects, (unitary description of
attraction
and repulsion!)
And I was expecting mainly, comments regarding this new picture from
you
and the other guys.
(I am not aware if there were other guys before me with the same idea.
There may well be, but I do not know at this time.)
Best regards, LL


author: GSS

text:
On Apr 22, 6:24 am, xray4abc <[email]> wrote:

It seems we are dealing with too many unknowns here.
We do not know whether CHARGE is a physical entity by itself or a
characteristic interaction property of some specific physical entity
(the electron positron pair). Further, apart from a specific
mathematical notion, we really do not know what exactly the term FIELD
imply physically. When we say that at point P1, there is an electric
field of intensity E1, a magnetic field of intensity B1, and
gravitational field of intensity F1, what exactly do we understand
that PHYSICALLY exists at point P1?

As observed by Charles Francis in another thread, 'mathematical models
of physics' must correspond to 'certain aspects' of physical world or
must represent 'certain aspects' of the physical reality. We don't
know what physical reality actually exists at point P1 which
correspond to the mathematical notions of electic FIELD E1, magnetic
FIELD B1 and gravitational FIELD F1. Could it be the characteristic
geometric properties or dynamic distortions of the space continuum
that give rise to the specific FIELD effects?

It can be easily shown that when we specify the geometry of space
through specification of a differential metric, it implies we are
dealing with a deformable space. But it is well known from the study
of continuum mechanics, that the state of infinitesimal deformation in
space continuum can be best described by specifying the displacement
vector U at all space points. However, physical space is characterized
by the physical properties of permittivity (eps_0), permeability
(mu_0), and intrinsic impedance (Z_0). Therefore, we need to explore
whether the electric and magnetic fields at any point P1 could be
correlated with the 'variation' of displacement vector U in that
region of space. Indeed, in my book, "Fundamental Nature of Matter and
Fields", I have shown that,
E = - (1/eps_0).(1/c).DU/Dt  where D stands for the partial derivative
symbol.
B = (1/c).(1/eps_0). (curl(U))
https://sites.google.com/a/fundamentalphysics.info/book/Home/book_files/chapter14.pdf?attredirects=0&d=1

That is, the dynamic distortions of the space continuum do give rise
to the specific FIELD effects. Not only that, even the elementary or
composite matter particles can also be shown to exist in space as
characteristic bounded regions of 'dynamic distortions' of space.
https://sites.google.com/a/fundamentalphysics.info/book/Home/book_files/introduction.pdf?attredirects=0&d=1

"The detailed study of any deformed or the stressed region of the
Elastic Space Continuum primarily involves the detailed solution of
the equilibrium equations subject to appropriate boundary conditions.
In the deformed or stressed state of the Elastic Space Continuum,
certain amount of strain energy will get stored in the region under
stress. The strain energy density W or the energy of deformation per
unit volume, at any point of the continuum, is a function of the
intensity of strain at that point, and is an invariant. The strain
energy density in the Elastic Space Continuum is given by W =
(1/2eps_0)[Sum of squares of spatial and temporal strain components]."

"A closed region of Elastic Space Continuum in a strained state,
satisfying the equilibrium equations & boundary conditions, may be
termed as a strain bubble, provided the total strain energy content in
this closed region is time invariant constant. Although the strain
components at any point within the strain bubble are always functions
of space and time coordinates, yet the strain energy density at that
point may or may not vary with time. If the strain energy density at
all points within a strain bubble is time invariant, the strain bubble
is likely to be stable, otherwise unstable. The total strain energy
content E0 of a strain bubble will represent its 'rest mass' m0
through the famous energy equivalence relation E_0/c^2 = m_0."

"If the strain fields of two strain bubbles overlap in a certain
region of the Continuum, then total strain components will be obtained
by superposing the corresponding components of both the strain
bubbles. Strain energy density and hence the total energy of the
common field will be governed by the sum of squares of the resultant
strain components. Interaction energy (E_int) or the conventional
potential energy, of two such interacting strain bubbles is defined as
the difference between the total strain energy with superposed strain
fields (E_sup) and the sum of their separate strain field energies
(E_1 and E_2) that is, E_int = E_sup - (E_1+ E_2). A negative
interaction energy or potential energy will imply release of a portion
of the total strain energy of two interacting bubbles. The released
energy may either transform into another strain bubble wholly or
partly and emitted out of the system, or transform into kinetic energy
of motion of the interacting strain bubbles."

"We have obtained particular solutions for the strain bubbles that
correspond to well known stable particles namely electron, positron,
proton, neutron and the photon. Strain bubble solutions that
correspond to neutrinos and some of the unstable particles like
mesons, have also been discussed. Specifically the electron, positron
pair is found to be the lowest order spherically symmetric strain
bubble solution of equilibrium equations. This strain bubble consists
of standing strain wave core of about 1.61x10^-15 m (1.61 fm) radius,
surrounded by a radially propagating phase wave field extending up to
infinity. The amplitude of these phase waves keeps diminishing with
radial distance. These phase waves propagate outwards from the core at
radial velocity c for the positron and propagate inwards to the core
at radial velocity c for the electron. The effective strain components
in this wave field are proportional to the 'root mean square' (rms)
value of the amplitude of the corresponding strain waves. The unique
characteristic features of these radial strain wave fields manifest in
the unique charge property of these strain bubbles. Detailed
computations of strain energy content show that almost 65 percent of
the total mass energy of the electron is contained in its core and
remaining 35 percent in its field."

GSS
http://book.fundamentalphysics.info/


text:
On Apr 29, 12:53 pm, "Szczepan Bialek" <[email]> wrote:
...

https://sites.google.com/a/fundamentalphysics.info/book/Home/book_files/chapter2.pdf?attredirects=0&d=1

"Now, there is a growing realization in scientific circles that matter
and electromagnetic field, both appear to have a common origin in
empty space or vacuum. There is also a notion of vacuum energy and the
phenomenon of creation, annihilation and transmutation of unstable
elementary particles occurring in vacuum. As per the current
viewpoint, empty space or vacuum no longer represents 'nothingness'
but is supposed to be the seat of, or supporter of, all ultra-
microscopic phenomenon of nature. This entity representing the old
'empty space' or vacuum has now been assigned a modern name of
'quantum vacuum'. This reincarnation of poor old aether certainly
looks much more sophisticated and acceptable. The 'quantum vacuum' is
thought of as - "a seething froth of real particle-virtual particle
pairs going in and out of existence continuously and very rapidly".
The quantum vacuum is considered to be a dynamic condition of
equilibrium in which this reversible process is occurring everywhere
extremely quickly. In reality however, all these notions of physical
space, empty space, vacuum, aether and their modern reincarnation the
quantum vacuum, all mean the same entity – call it by any name. Hence,
the physical space continuum, referred by any other name like vacuum
or quantum vacuum or aether will still have the same physical
properties. We will however, prefer to call this entity 'Elastic Space
Continuum'."

"One crucial question that needs to be answered is:- how exactly do we
detect the existence of aether or vacuum or the elastic space
continuum? The detection and measurement of any physical entity
actually involves the detection and measurement of some of its
characteristic attributes. Such characteristic attributes of the
Aether or the Elastic Space Continuum are eps_0 , mu_0 , c and Z_0 ,
which are well known and have been measured quite precisely. However,
there is one special feature of this detection on which scientists had
persistently focused their attention for a long long time. Since the
aether or vacuum represent the physical space within which all
material particles and fields of the universe are embedded, we should
be able to define a special coordinate reference frame which is at
rest in this physical space or aether. This special reference frame is
termed as the absolute or universal reference frame. In principle we
should be able to refer the motion of all material particles in the
universe to this absolute reference frame and all such motion will
then be termed as absolute motion. It has been argued that to detect
the existence of aether, we should be able to detect this absolute
reference frame."

In this regard I have published a paper titled "Proposed experiment
for detection of absolute motion" in Physics Essays (An International
Journal dedicated to fundamental questions in Physics, http://www.physicsessays.com/
). The abstract of this paper is reproduced below.

[According to special theory of relativity, all motion is relative and
existence of any privileged or absolute inertial frame of reference,
which could be practically distinguished from all other inertial
frames, is ruled out. However, we may define an absolute or universal
reference frame as the one which is at rest with respect to the center
of mass of the universe and assume the speed c of propagation of light
to be an isotropic universal constant in that frame. Any motion with
respect to such a reference frame will be called "absolute motion."
The proposed experiment establishes the feasibility of detection of
such an absolute motion by measuring the up-link and down-link signal
propagation times between two fixed points on the surface of earth.
With current technological advancements in pulsed lasers, detectors,
precision atomic clocks, and computers, feasibility of the proposed
experiment has been confirmed. Successful conduct of the proposed
experiment will initiate a paradigm shift in fundamental physics.
Phys. Essays 23, 442 (2010)]

http://physicsessays.org/resource/1/phesem/v23/i3/p442_s1?isAuthorized=no

In brief, the proposed experiment involves measurement of to and fro
light propagation times between two fixed points on earth. Let us
consider two points A and B fixed on the surface of earth (at equal
gravitational potential) and aligned along east-west direction. Let
the separation distance AB be about 30 to 50 km. Position two
identical precision atomic clocks mid-way between A and B and mutually
synchronize them in close-by position. After synchronizing, shift the
two clocks to stations A and B by slow transport. Now as part of the
experiment, send a light pulse from A to B and record its time of
flight with the two clocks at A and B. Let this measured time of
flight be T_ab. Then send another light pulse from B to A and record
its time of flight with the two clocks. Let this measured time of
flight be T_ba. Repeat these to and fro time of flight measurements
for a period of 24 hours. Find the maximum difference in the to and
fro flight times, |T_ab-T_ba| over the test period.

As per SR (if the second postulate is true), this to and fro flight
time difference |T_ab-T_ba| must be of the order of zero (or a random
scatter of values within +/- 5 nano-seconds). On the other hand, if
the second postulate is not true, then the maximum difference in the
to and fro flight times, |T_ab-T_ba| is expected to be in the range of
about 200 nano-seconds.

The proposed experiment can be conducted by many space agencies,
research centers and academic institutions provided they get motivated
for undertaking this challenging task. The proposed method of
detecting absolute motion in space is considered very simple but
unique, the like of which has not been conducted by anyone as yet. It
is unique in the following respects.
(a)There is no attempt to measure the one-way or two-way speed of
light.
(b)There is no need to measure the distance between the two fixed
points on the surface of earth for conducting this experiment.
(c)There is no dependence on the wave properties of light for
measuring any interference effects or fringe shifts. It does not
involve any reflection of waves from moving mirrors.
(d)For detecting absolute motion in space, we only need to measure the
up-link (T_ab) and down-link (T_ba) signal propagation times between
two locations on the surface of earth. It does not require the use of
any satellite or the GPS system.
(e)The result depends on the difference between T_ab and T_ba, due to
which the hardware delays and atmospheric signal propagation delays
get canceled out and do not influence the result. Commercially
available Cesium atomic clocks provide time measurement accuracy of
the order of about one nanosecond, which is sufficient for the conduct
of the proposed experiment.

GSS
http://book.fundamentalphysics.info/


author: Szczepan Bialek

text:
"xray4abc" <[email]> napisal w wiadomosci
news:[email]...
Hi
I have been lately rethinking some of the basics of electricity.
(Outrageous, yesï¿½. but I canï¿½t stop myself.)
It occurred to me that there is something wrong with the classical
picture of two interacting electrical charges which says:
ï¿½Letï¿½s consider two electrically charged particles having  the same
kind of electricity.
One of the particles creates a force-field , which then acts on a
second  particle and  pushes  it from its current position, toward an
area of the field where the field is LESS stronger than in the
current
position.
If the particles are of opposite charges, then each particle is
pushed
by the field created by the other one, from its current position
toward  the field area with a HIGHER intensity of the fieldï¿½
Now, just think:
ï¿½     A charge creates a field
ï¿½     A second charge creates an electrical field as well
ï¿½     We presume that the action on a particle happens ON its surface
ï¿½     In the proximity of the second charge the properties of the
resulting field are given mainly by ITS OWN charge, no matter how
small that charge is
ï¿½     Nevertheless, this charged particle is pushed according to a
rule
which changes with the type of charge of the first particle (Theï¿½
field-makerï¿½)
ï¿½     The same applies for the first charge
Doesnï¿½t seem this an oversimplification?
In fact, what we should see here is a qualitatively different
picture:
ï¿½     The first charged particle creates an undefined (for now) change
in
the surrounding matter.(Note that, here I use the word ï¿½matterï¿½ as a
word for all physically detectable reality, like philosophers use it
in dialectical materialism!)
ï¿½     One may call this change: electrical field
ï¿½     The second charged particle creates the same way a change in
the
surrounding medium/matter/space   (choose the word you like and
ignore
the others).
ï¿½     Let us suppose here that both charges are positive
ï¿½     Near  the second body/particle both of the 2 influences are
felt
ï¿½     Same applies for the first particle
ï¿½     We observe that between the charges, the 2 fields are opposite,
while on the other side of them the 2 fields are of same effect.
ï¿½     We can say then for sure, that in the space area between the
charges, the combined influence of the two charges is less than in
the
outside space area (for simplicity, consider only points on the
straight line which goes through both particles)
ï¿½     THEN the 2 particles are pushed from a lower intensity
electrical
field-area toward a higher intensity field-area, which is exactly the
opposite of the usual way of understanding the phenomenon.
ï¿½     SURPRISINGLY, the very same conclusion results  for the case of
the
interaction of two opposite kind of electrical charges!
ï¿½     The conclusion from the above is that, if we take into account
the
influence of all the charges that create the resultant electrical
field, then all charged particles are acted upon the SAME way, no
matter what kind of electrical charge they have got : FROM A LOWER
INTENSITY FIELD AREA TOWARD A HIGHER INTENSITY FIELD AREA!
ï¿½     Again, not to forget: This conclusion is based on the idea that
in
reality what acts on a charged particle is NOT a particular
electrical
field but the field created by all participants,
the particle in question included!
Best regards, LL

<Start with the charged body and the neutral body. They attract. After
contact they repel.

<they same is with the strongly charged body and the week charged body (the
same electricity).
S*


text:
On Apr 22, 2:10 pm, "Szczepan Bialek" <[email]> wrote:

And? What does this change, if any, regarding what I have said?
Regards,LL


text:
Uzytkownik "Laszlo Lemhenyi" <[email]> napisal w wiadomosci
news:[email]...
On Apr 23, 12:12 pm, "Szczepan Bialek" <[email]> wrote:

<Let say, electrically charged particles or charged bodies where we dot
have

You wrote: "I have been lately rethinking some of the basics of electricity.
(Outrageous, yes.. but I can't stop myself.)
It occurred to me that there is something wrong with the classical
picture of two interacting electrical charges which says:
"Let's consider two electrically charged particles .."

The classical picture is for the two electric fluids.

In today's picture there is a deficit or excess of electrons.

Next you wrote: "   The first charged particle creates an undefined (for
now) change
in
the surrounding matter.(Note that, here I use the word "matter" as a
word for all physically detectable reality, like philosophers use it
in dialectical materialism!)
.     One may call this change: electrical field
.     The second charged particle creates the same way a change in
the
surrounding medium/matter/space   (choose the word you like and
ignore
the others)."

Charged body with the excess of electrons creates a change in
the surrounding medium/matter/space  in different  way than a body with the
deficit of electrons.

In space the charge disappear (field emission of electrons).
S*


text:
Uzytkownik "Laszlo Lemhenyi" <[email]> napisal w wiadomosci
news:[email]...
On Apr 27, 12:49 pm, "Szczepan Bialek" <[email]> wrote:

<You said: "In today's picture there is a deficit or excess of
electrons. "
<Yes and no! Electrical charge is not  a property just of the
electrons.
<Then, there is one more aspect to consider:
<Even if the electrical charge is quantized, the behavior of a metalic
object with
<1 electron in excess is, as if that charge would be distributed
continuously on its surface. (there is no spatial quantization is this
case)

One electron in excess cause the shorter distances between the free
electrons on the surface.

<And this is normal, as of course nobody
can tell WHICH electron is the surpluss one.
The same way,as far as I know, an electric current
through a conductor is NOT quantized. That means, IF we calculate
that
the intensity of the current corresponds to, let say, 5.4 electrons
passing through a
cross-section of the conductor at any moment of time, the meaning of
this
value is only a  statistical one.
Considering this, the idea of an electrical fluid has a similar
meaning
with the "statistical electrons" and may have the same usefulness for
computing purposses

NO. The self capaticance of a metal sphere is diffrent for fluid and for
electrons (r or r^2).

<      Anyway, I do not  think that it matters HOW the electrical
charge of
a microscopical or a macroscopical object is obtained, that is, adding
electrons,
removing electrons or by any other means.
<I was talking about something else, which might not be liked by some
people, for it may bring up the subject of the aether again.
(At this point, it is not my intent to discuss it as well.)

You are right. We know from Faraday that in spase no aetrher but the rare
plasma:  http://www.phy6.org/Education/wfarad1846.html

<What I have said,was: the idea of a force-field created by a charged
object is a good mathematical idea but a poor physical idea.
Then I have showed, that using another picture of what is happening,
we get another way of understanding an electrostatical interaction
 which is valid no matter what kind of charges have
two electrically interacting objects, (unitary description of
attraction
and repulsion!)
<And I was expecting mainly, comments regarding this new picture from
you
and the other guys.
<(I am not aware if there were other guys before me with the same idea.
There may well be, but I do not know at this time.)

The new picture: "  Let us suppose here that both charges are positive
.     Near  the second body/particle both of the 2 influences are
felt
.     Same applies for the first particle
.     We observe that between the charges, the 2 fields are opposite,
while on the other side of them the 2 fields are of same effect.
.     We can say then for sure, that in the space area between the
charges, the combined influence of the two charges is less than in
the
outside space area (for simplicity, consider only points on the
straight line which goes through both particles)
.     THEN the 2 particles are pushed from a lower intensity
electrical
field-area toward a higher intensity field-area, which is exactly the
opposite of the usual way of understanding the phenomenon.
.     SURPRISINGLY, the very same conclusion results  for the case of
the
interaction of two opposite kind of electrical charges!
.     The conclusion from the above is that, if we take into account
the
influence of all the charges that create the resultant electrical
field, then all charged particles are acted upon the SAME way, no
matter what kind of electrical charge they have got : FROM A LOWER
INTENSITY FIELD AREA TOWARD A HIGHER INTENSITY FIELD AREA!"

In physics are the two methods: the field method and the charge method. See:
http://www.df.lth.se/~snorkelf/Longitudinal/node4.html
S*


text:
Uzytkownik "Laszlo Lemhenyi" <[email]> napisal w wiadomosci
news:[email]...
you
and the other guys.

You wrote: "    The conclusion from the above is that, if we take into
account
the
influence of all the charges that create the resultant electrical
field, then all charged particles are acted upon the SAME way, no
matter what kind of electrical charge they have got : FROM A LOWER
INTENSITY FIELD AREA TOWARD A HIGHER INTENSITY FIELD AREA!"

It is not true for the charged bodies. Strongly charged attracts a week
charged no matter what kind of electrical charge it has got.
S*


text:
Uzytkownik "GSS" <[email]> napisal w wiadomosci
news:[email]...
We do not know whether CHARGE is a physical entity by itself or a
characteristic interaction property of some specific physical entity
(the electron positron pair). Further, apart from a specific
mathematical notion, we really do not know what exactly the term FIELD
imply physically. When we say that at point P1, there is an electric
field of intensity E1, a magnetic field of intensity B1, and
gravitational field of intensity F1, what exactly do we understand
that PHYSICALLY exists at point P1?

Faraday wrote: "Mossotti has shown that gravitation, aggregation, electric
force, and electro-chemical action may all have one common connection or
origin;"

of physics' must correspond to 'certain aspects' of physical world or
must represent 'certain aspects' of the physical reality. We don't
know what physical reality actually exists at point P1 which
correspond to the mathematical notions of electic FIELD E1, magnetic
FIELD B1 and gravitational FIELD F1. Could it be the characteristic
geometric properties or dynamic distortions of the space continuum
that give rise to the specific FIELD effects?

Faraday predicted that in space is ISM (electrons, ions and dust).

through specification of a differential metric, it implies we are
dealing with a deformable space. But it is well known from the study
of continuum mechanics, that the state of infinitesimal deformation in
space continuum can be best described by specifying the displacement
vector U at all space points. However, physical space is characterized
by the physical properties of permittivity (eps_0), permeability
(mu_0), and intrinsic impedance (Z_0).

It is a clacical "picture". What characterize the ISM (rare plasma and
dust)?

whether the electric and magnetic fields at any point P1 could be
correlated with the 'variation' of displacement vector U in that
region of space. Indeed, in my book, "Fundamental Nature of Matter and
Fields", I have shown that,
E = - (1/eps_0).(1/c).DU/Dt  where D stands for the partial derivative
symbol.
B = (1/c).(1/eps_0). (curl(U))
https://sites.google.com/a/fundamentalphysics.info/book/Home/book_files/chapter14.pdf?attredirects=0&d=1

to the specific FIELD effects. Not only that, even the elementary or
composite matter particles can also be shown to exist in space as
characteristic bounded regions of 'dynamic distortions' of space.
https://sites.google.com/a/fundamentalphysics.info/book/Home/book_files/introduction.pdf?attredirects=0&d=1

Elastic Space Continuum primarily involves the detailed solution of
the equilibrium equations subject to appropriate boundary conditions.
In the deformed or stressed state of the Elastic Space Continuum,
certain amount of strain energy will get stored in the region under
stress. The strain energy density W or the energy of deformation per
unit volume, at any point of the continuum, is a function of the
intensity of strain at that point, and is an invariant. The strain
energy density in the Elastic Space Continuum is given by W =
(1/2eps_0)[Sum of squares of spatial and temporal strain components]."

satisfying the equilibrium equations & boundary conditions, may be
termed as a strain bubble, provided the total strain energy content in
this closed region is time invariant constant. Although the strain
components at any point within the strain bubble are always functions
of space and time coordinates, yet the strain energy density at that
point may or may not vary with time. If the strain energy density at
all points within a strain bubble is time invariant, the strain bubble
is likely to be stable, otherwise unstable. The total strain energy
content E0 of a strain bubble will represent its 'rest mass' m0
through the famous energy equivalence relation E_0/c^2 = m_0."

region of the Continuum, then total strain components will be obtained
by superposing the corresponding components of both the strain
bubbles. Strain energy density and hence the total energy of the
common field will be governed by the sum of squares of the resultant
strain components. Interaction energy (E_int) or the conventional
potential energy, of two such interacting strain bubbles is defined as
the difference between the total strain energy with superposed strain
fields (E_sup) and the sum of their separate strain field energies
(E_1 and E_2) that is, E_int = E_sup - (E_1+ E_2). A negative
interaction energy or potential energy will imply release of a portion
of the total strain energy of two interacting bubbles. The released
energy may either transform into another strain bubble wholly or
partly and emitted out of the system, or transform into kinetic energy
of motion of the interacting strain bubbles."

correspond to well known stable particles namely electron, positron,
proton, neutron and the photon. Strain bubble solutions that
correspond to neutrinos and some of the unstable particles like
mesons, have also been discussed. Specifically the electron, positron
pair is found to be the lowest order spherically symmetric strain
bubble solution of equilibrium equations. This strain bubble consists
of standing strain wave core of about 1.61x10^-15 m (1.61 fm) radius,
surrounded by a radially propagating phase wave field extending up to
infinity. The amplitude of these phase waves keeps diminishing with
radial distance. These phase waves propagate outwards from the core at
radial velocity c for the positron and propagate inwards to the core
at radial velocity c for the electron. The effective strain components
in this wave field are proportional to the 'root mean square' (rms)
value of the amplitude of the corresponding strain waves. The unique
characteristic features of these radial strain wave fields manifest in
the unique charge property of these strain bubbles. Detailed
computations of strain energy content show that almost 65 percent of
the total mass energy of the electron is contained in its core and
remaining 35 percent in its field."

GSS
http://book.fundamentalphysics.info/

Is Your " Elastic Space Continuum " like a mystery aether or like ISM?
S*


text:
Uzytkownik "GSS" <[email]> napisal w wiadomosci
news:[email]...
On Apr 29, 12:53 pm, "Szczepan Bialek" <[email]> wrote:
...

https://sites.google.com/a/fundamentalphysics.info/book/Home/book_files/chapter2.pdf?attredirects=0&d=1

and electromagnetic field, both appear to have a common origin in
empty space or vacuum. There is also a notion of vacuum energy and the
phenomenon of creation, annihilation and transmutation of unstable
elementary particles occurring in vacuum. As per the current
viewpoint, empty space or vacuum no longer represents 'nothingness'
but is supposed to be the seat of, or supporter of, all ultra-
microscopic phenomenon of nature. This entity representing the old
'empty space' or vacuum has now been assigned a modern name of
'quantum vacuum'. This reincarnation of poor old aether certainly
looks much more sophisticated and acceptable. The 'quantum vacuum' is
thought of as - "a seething froth of real particle-virtual particle
pairs going in and out of existence continuously and very rapidly".

In Faraday's thoughts the pairs (electrons and ions) are real and vibrate.

equilibrium in which this reversible process is occurring everywhere
extremely quickly. In reality however, all these notions of physical
space, empty space, vacuum, aether and their modern reincarnation the
quantum vacuum, all mean the same entity ï¿½ call it by any name. Hence,
the physical space continuum, referred by any other name like vacuum
or quantum vacuum or aether will still have the same physical
properties. We will however, prefer to call this entity 'Elastic Space
Continuum'."

But the waves in the space will be always "aether waves".

detect the existence of aether or vacuum or the elastic space
continuum? The detection and measurement of any physical entity
actually involves the detection and measurement of some of its
characteristic attributes.

The most important is to know if it is stationary. Michelson measured that
it rotate with the Sun but do not rotate with the Earth.

Aether or the Elastic Space Continuum are eps_0 , mu_0 , c and Z_0 ,
which are well known and have been measured quite precisely.

Rare plasma is a conductor.

there is one special feature of this detection on which scientists had
persistently focused their attention for a long long time. Since the
aether or vacuum represent the physical space within which all
material particles and fields of the universe are embedded, we should
be able to define a special coordinate reference frame which is at
rest in this physical space or aether.

Aether localy rotate with stars. Stars produce the plazma.

termed as the absolute or universal reference frame. In principle we
should be able to refer the motion of all material particles in the
universe to this absolute reference frame and all such motion will
then be termed as absolute motion. It has been argued that to detect
the existence of aether, we should be able to detect this absolute
reference frame."

It is ovious that plazma rotate with the Sun. Is your aether between the
ions and electrons?

for detection of absolute motion" in Physics Essays (An International
Journal dedicated to fundamental questions in Physics,
http://www.physicsessays.com/
). The abstract of this paper is reproduced below.

existence of any privileged or absolute inertial frame of reference,
which could be practically distinguished from all other inertial
frames, is ruled out. However, we may define an absolute or universal
reference frame as the one which is at rest with respect to the center
of mass of the universe and assume the speed c of propagation of light
to be an isotropic universal constant in that frame. Any motion with
respect to such a reference frame will be called "absolute motion."
The proposed experiment establishes the feasibility of detection of
such an absolute motion by measuring the up-link and down-link signal
propagation times between two fixed points on the surface of earth.
With current technological advancements in pulsed lasers, detectors,
precision atomic clocks, and computers, feasibility of the proposed
experiment has been confirmed. Successful conduct of the proposed
experiment will initiate a paradigm shift in fundamental physics.
Phys. Essays 23, 442 (2010)]

http://physicsessays.org/resource/1/phesem/v23/i3/p442_s1?isAuthorized=no

In brief, the proposed experiment involves measurement of to and fro
light propagation times between two fixed points on earth.

Michelson and Gale did it in 1925.
Let us
consider two points A and B fixed on the surface of earth (at equal
gravitational potential) and aligned along east-west direction. Let
the separation distance AB be about 30 to 50 km. Position two
identical precision atomic clocks mid-way between A and B and mutually
synchronize them in close-by position. After synchronizing, shift the
two clocks to stations A and B by slow transport. Now as part of the
experiment, send a light pulse from A to B and record its time of
flight with the two clocks at A and B. Let this measured time of
flight be T_ab. Then send another light pulse from B to A and record
its time of flight with the two clocks. Let this measured time of
flight be T_ba. Repeat these to and fro time of flight measurements
for a period of 24 hours. Find the maximum difference in the to and
fro flight times, |T_ab-T_ba| over the test period.

SR was wrote in 1905. After 1925 Albert could not wrote: "Examples of this
sort, together with the unsuccessful attempts to discover any motion of the
earth relatively to the ï¿½light medium,ï¿½

time difference |T_ab-T_ba| must be of the order of zero (or a random
scatter of values within +/- 5 nano-seconds). On the other hand, if
the second postulate is not true, then the maximum difference in the
to and fro flight times, |T_ab-T_ba| is expected to be in the range of
about 200 nano-seconds.

research centers and academic institutions provided they get motivated
for undertaking this challenging task. The proposed method of
detecting absolute motion in space is considered very simple but
unique, the like of which has not been conducted by anyone as yet. It
is unique in the following respects.
(a)There is no attempt to measure the one-way or two-way speed of
light.
(b)There is no need to measure the distance between the two fixed
points on the surface of earth for conducting this experiment.
(c)There is no dependence on the wave properties of light for
measuring any interference effects or fringe shifts. It does not
involve any reflection of waves from moving mirrors.
(d)For detecting absolute motion in space, we only need to measure the
up-link (T_ab) and down-link (T_ba) signal propagation times between
two locations on the surface of earth. It does not require the use of
any satellite or the GPS system.
(e)The result depends on the difference between T_ab and T_ba, due to
which the hardware delays and atmospheric signal propagation delays
get canceled out and do not influence the result. Commercially
available Cesium atomic clocks provide time measurement accuracy of
the order of about one nanosecond, which is sufficient for the conduct
of the proposed experiment.

GSS
http://book.fundamentalphysics.info/

I appreciate all aether theories but I am sure that Faraday is right (no
aether but vibrating real particles).

Am I alone?
S*


text:
"xray4abc" <[email]> napisal w wiadomosci
news:[email]...
On Apr 22, 2:10 pm, "Szczepan Bialek" <[email]> wrote:

<And? What does this change, if any, regarding what I have said?
Regards,LL

Your thoughts will be understable. Now we need some clarification:

What do you consider: Electrical charge, electrically charged particles
(ions, electrons) or charged bodies?
S*


author: greg miller

subject: Lost Buoy

text:
I recently received a call from an Alaskan Native saying that
he had found an orange buoy with a black bottom.  It is about 2.5 feet
in diameter weighing 35 pounds.  There are no owner markings, but it
has ID# 7225 and "SR# 10881".  There is no indication as to what it
is.  It was found on the beach somewhere along the Bering Straits.
Anyone who has lost something similar in the area might want to call
Metmetorsan Rukozishnikoss (???) at (907) 546-2271.


author: Thomas Wilson

subject: Re: Lost Buoy

text:
In article <[email]>,
greg miller  <[email]> wrote:
         ^^^^
         ||||
Looks like an ARGOS PTT ID number to me.  Call Service ARGOS (301-925-4411)
and they can tell you who the ID is assigned to.  2.5 feet diameter sounds a
little big for a drifting buoy (like a WOCE drifter) but maybe something was
lost in translation?

    Thomas C. Wilson / Ocean Instrument Lab / Marine Sciences
  State University of New York / Stony Brook NY 11794-5000 USA
Tel: 516-632-8706 / FAX: 516-632-8820 / [email]
     "Opinions expressed are not necessarily, etc. etc...."

           "Oceanography is not for Wimps" - Bob Ballard


author: Dmitrii Manin

subject: Re: Lost Buoy

text:
In article <[email]> greg miller <[email]> writes:

o 	I recently received a call from an Alaskan Native saying that
o he had found an orange buoy with a black bottom.  [......]
o Anyone who has lost something similar in the area might want to call
o Metmetorsan Rukozishnikoss (???) at (907) 546-2271.
              ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Sorry for the perhaps inappropriate followup, but I'm intrigued by the
name of the Alaskan Native. It sounds suspiciously similar to a
frequent Russian surname Rukavishnikoff, especially if you got it from
handwriting (v->z, s->f, a->o are very plausible).


author: miguel maccio

subject: comparator/trimpot/LED all in one

text:
HI there,
	Wonder if anybody knows of a comparator+trimpot+LED all in one
or two IC's?
	I need to monitor 50 or so signal levels and space is becoming a
burden.
TXS.


author: Brian

subject: Re: comparator/trimpot/LED all in one

text:
miguel maccio ([email]) wrote:
: HI there,
: 	Wonder if anybody knows of a comparator+trimpot+LED all in one
: or two IC's?
: 	I need to monitor 50 or so signal levels and space is becoming a
: burden.
: TXS.

a 741, an LED and a trimpot. I think that is the best you can do.

-Brian


author: Henry Spencer

subject: Re: comparator/trimpot/LED all in one

text:
In article <3k5ta5$[email]> [email] (Brian ) writes:

There's no fundamental reason why you couldn't package these three things
in one DIP-type package, but it would be expensive and I don't know of
anyone who does it.

However, it sounds like the original poster wants to do a bunch of them
at a time.  *That* opens up some other possibilities, because some of
these things do come more than one to a package.

Fairly obviously, any quad op amp like the LM324 will give you four
comparators in a package.  (Actually, it's better to use real comparators,
not op amps, but the comparators also come in quads.)

You can easily find packages with ten LEDs in a 20-pin DIP.

Trimpots are harder, but I think you can get single-turn trimmers two to
a DIP, and if you're willing to do surface-mount soldering, there are
some very small surface-mount single-turn trimmers.  Don't know about
multi-turn ones, which would probably be preferable.  Of course, if
you're willing to go high-tech, you can have a one-chip micro driving
a bunch of eight-output serial DACs...

So even disregarding the high tech and assuming the trimpots don't
shrink, that still takes you down to 0.35 of an IC, plus a trimpot,
per signal.


author: John Bunting

subject: Re: comparator/trimpot/LED all in one

text:
Henry Spencer <[email]> writes:

Don't you want a voltage reference also in that chip?
Motorola makes a neat voltage detector chip MC14151 I believe or close to
that number.  It has 4 comparators and a voltage referece in an 8 pin
dip.  Also it has a mode pin to set it up as 2 window detectors, 4 single
comparators, etc.  I think you will find the ref. is necessary to get good
repeatability, low drift, avoid oscillations.

John Bunting  [email]  Quincy, IL


author: WriteWord Translations

subject: Achsengerecht?

text:
Hello, guten Tag etc.

Would anyone be able to tell me what "achsengerecht means in the following
sentence:

"Orthopantomogramm nach Abschluss der Behandlung; relativ achsengerechte
Einstellung der Schneidezï¿½hne im Unterkiefer, jedoch Mesialkippung des
Zahnes 43, sonst keine nennenswerten Verï¿½nderungen."

Could it maybe mean "axial"? That's my feeling, but any confirmation or
correction of this would be appreciated. Thank you, danke etc. in advance
for your assistance.

Best Regards

ROWAN MORRELL
(WriteWord Translations, Wellington NZ - Independent Freelancer)


author: Bettina Price

subject: Re: Achsengerecht?

text:
"WriteWord Translations" <[email]> wrote in message
news:16LM7.1954$[email]...

Hello again :-)
"Achsengerecht" literally means something like "true to an (ideal)axis". I
would assume that the axis referred to is the axis of rotation of the jaw,
or maybe another ideal line that dentists define.
(quick look on google: http://www.dysgnathie.de/behandlung2.htm actually
gives a description).
Maybe something like the "correct relative axial alignment" would hit the
spot?

We've got to stop meeting like this...

Greetings,

Bettina


author: Tron Furu

subject: Re: Achsengerecht?

text:
WriteWord Translations skrev i meldingen
<16LM7.1954$[email]>...

relatively fair axial alignment of lower mandible incisors...?
If so, it can pertain to the relation of teeth to direction (axis) of
movement in biting, such that non-alignment would result in diagonal/lateral
pressure on teeth, resulting in improper "bite", improper wear and possible
dislocation.

TF


author: Barbara Kraus

subject: Re: Achsengerecht?

text:
achsengerecht in this case is the opposite of the Kippen you have later on
in the sentence. It simply means that the tooth went in straight (in
accordance with its natural axis)

Barbara


subject: Re: Achsengerecht?

text:
Thank you once again Bettina for a good and helpful answer. Much
appreciated. It has definitely improved my understanding of the word.

Awww, and just when it was getting interesting. ;-)

Best Regards
MfG

ROWAN MORRELL
(WriteWord Translations, Wellington NZ)


author: Mr Posting Robot

subject: Re: From Yesterday's Bolt Report, Holding Alarmists To Account

text:
BONZO@27-32-240-172 [numerous nyms] wrote:

The Bolt Report: all Bolt, no report

Tim Dick
Sydney Morning Herald
May 9, 2011

Not having seen every attempt at television current affairs in Australia, it
is impossible to judge The Bolt Report the worst. But surely it comes close.

Andrew Bolt's Sun morning shift from panellist on ABC Insiders to his own
show on Network Ten has brought talk-back to TV, but it didn't bring a
pulse. It is named for Bolt, hosted by Bolt, and dominated by the Boltian
worldview. It featured white middle-aged men talking about Boltian
fundamentals - namely, the great climate change con and those refugees taking
over the country - with a surfing Afghan refugee beamed in to be scolded for
high unemployment among his compatriots.

The most interesting aspect of the 1st instalment is whether there will be a
second. In its favour is that there are so few people who watch TV on Sun
mornings, it doesn't really matter what is on the screen. Perhaps Ten could
try the test signal next wk for a livelier program.

Neither the energetic jingle, a red-on-red set, nor a logo recalling James
Bond could lift Bolt's program into the compelling car-crash television it
presumably is meant to be. It ended up being Bolt's tabloid newspaper column
on the small screen, with the same topics but without its impact. It is also
harder to skim to the predictable point and get your life back.

Bolt's skill is to write the outrageous and craft an agenda, often based on
"facts" which are little more than fantasy. He allowed his 1st guest, Tony
Abbott, for instance, to bag the government's climate change ambassador, Tim
Flannery, for his recent comment that global climate action would have no
effect for 1000 years.

Bolt, among the most ideological of interviewers, was never going to point out
that Flannery didn't say that. His point was that while climate action would
not reduce average global temperatures for as many as 1000 years, such action
is aimed at mitigating further temperature increases. But that does not fit
Boltian fundamentals.

He must have been delighted to hear of Julia Gillard's announcement on
Sat of a plan to swap some 800 asylum seekers for 4000 refugees with
Malaysia. It duly dominated the program, with Abbott parroting Bolt's lines,
and Liberal powerbroker Michael Kroger joining the show alongside Mark Latham
to furiously agree about how shockingly bad the government was.

It is hardly basking in glory right now, but general agreement is generally
dull, which is The Bolt Report in 2 words. Bolt is not dull. But if his show
continues in this fashion, it will prove only that he was better off where he
was on Sun morning, playing the contrarian on the ABC. And if Network Ten
gave Bolt a show to give us a reason to tune in on Sun mornings, we still
don't have one.

MYREF: 20110605160001 msg2011060512664

[218 more news items]

---
[It's not "land" warming -- it's just "ocean" warming!]
QUOTE: Evidence is presented that the recent worldwide land warming has
occurred largely in response to a worldwide warming of the oceans rather
than as a direct response to increasing greenhouse gases over land.
  -- BONZO@27-32-240-172 [100 nyms and counting], 14 Dec 2010 10:35 +1100


text:
...
...

Advertisers pull out of the newly-launched "Bolt Report"
Crikey
May 30, 2011

The advertising trade magazine B&T is claiming that at least 3 advertisers
have requested that their spots not be shown during Andrew Bolt's new show on
Channel Ten. The advertisers TeleChoice, MrRentals and iPrimus are understood
to have withdrawn, the article says.

Channel Ten is quoted as attributing the withdrawals to the fact that some
advertisers want a more youth oriented audience. Bolt's program has bumped
Ten's music video show, Video Hits, which attracts a young audience.

The article also notes that there a Facebook page with 968 followers that
calls on people to complain to advertisers about the show.

<http://www.bandt.com.au/getattachment/5b3fb425-6ee3-4535-a192-6662e9b36cde/pdf.
aspx>

MYREF: 20110530144911 msg2011053027638

[217 more news items]

---
Another problem that has to be taken seriously is a slow rise of sea level
which could become catastrophic if it continues to accelerate. We have
accurate measurements of sea level going back 200 years. We observe a
steady rise from 1800 to the present, with an acceleration during the last
50 years. It is widely believed that the recent acceleration is due to
human activities, since it coincides in time with the rapid increase of carbon
dioxide in the atmosphere.
  -- Freeman Dyson, "Many Colored Glass: Reflections on the Place of Life in the

Professor Freeman Dyson, World Renowned "Heir To Einstein" Physicist
  -- BONZO@27-32-240-172 [86 nyms and counting], 27 Feb 2011 12:50 +1100


author: B J Foster

text:
On 5/06/2011 4:00 PM, Mr Posting Robot wrote:

In the unlikely event that the Fabians get this great big new tax up and
the temperature does *not* rise (as we know it will *not*) then the
scamists can claim victory and *continue* to tax us for 1000 years.

Old Labor strategem. You're not fooling anyone anymore.


text:
"Mr Posting Robot" <[email]> wrote in message
news:4de32257$0$22473$[email]...

Just goes to show that Watermelons are dead against freedom of speech,
unless they're the only ones exploiting it, of course.


author: Stephens Lyle E

subject: Aircraft identity

text:
I'm trying to identify two aircraft in a photo taken at Moline, IL in the
1930's. The registrations numbers are NC726K and NC727K. Both aircraft have
2 of almost everything: wings, engines, fins and rudders, stabs and
elevators. Is there a historic registration database I can consult?


author: Philip Morten

subject: Re: Aircraft identity

text:
Stephens Lyle E wrote:

Those are Curtiss Type 53 Condor transports - first flown 1929, six
built,  used by Eastern Air Transport 1931-1934.

See Curtiss Aircraft 1907-1947, Peter M Bowers, Putnam 1979, ISBN
0-85177-811-9

Philip Moren


author: BrianM

subject: Re: Aircraft identity

text:
Stephens Lyle E wrote in message ...

Yes there is: http://aerofiles.com/regs-home.html
They were Curtiss Condors.

Brian


author: Stan Reeves

subject: Compressing halftone images

text:
I read in SP Magazine that "coding of halftone images, once thought to
have great promise, has not been successful."  I would like to find out
more information about this.  Can someone summarize what's been done in
this area and just how "unsucessful" the efforts have been?


author: Rick VanderKam

subject: Re: Compressing halftone images

text:
In article <[email]> [email] (Stan Reeves) writes:

I can't give an exhaustive summary, but can perhaps get you started.
I'll assume that you're referring to binary (monochrome) rather than
color halftoning.  There seems to be relatively more research activity
in the area of halftoning per se than there is in the area of
compression of halftoned images.  If you are interested in halftoning
by itself, see the Proceedings of the ICASSP-91, ICASSP-92, and
SPIE-92 conferences for some of the most recent proposed methods.  A
few (not all) of the relevant names are Neuhoff & Pappas, Zakhor, and
Allebach.  There is also Ulichney's book, _Digital Halftoning_, put
out by MIT Press (1987), which presents a variety of analyses on a
variety of halftoning techniques.

There are two forms of compression that you might be interested
in---lossless and lossy.  For lossless (noiseless, no information
loss) compression, the most promising method (in my opinion) is IBM's
Q-coder, which is documented by about five articles in the _IBM
Journal of Research and Development_, November, 1988 (Vol. 32, No. 6).
These articles have other useful references as well.  IBM is working
to have their system established as part of the Joint Binary Image
Group (JBIG) standard for compression.  It seems to be an excellent
noiseless coding scheme, which routinely produces coding rates that
achieve or beat the first-order entropy for a variety of halftoned
images.

For lossy compression, there have been a couple of published works in
which the halftoning and compression are done separately (Neuhoff &
Pappas, ICASSP-91; Y.-M. Chao, "An Investigation into the Coding of
Halftone Images," Ph.D. thesis, MIT, 1987).  I co-authored a paper
(with Chou, Riskin, and Gray) at
ICASSP-92 showing that a better idea is to do the halftoning and
compression jointly.  In that paper, we showed an image compressed at
about 11:1 which looks pretty decent (we think!).  We are continuing
to work on this problem here at Stanford.  Hope this helps....

Rick A. Vander Kam
[email]


author: Rick A. VanderKam

subject: Re: Compressing halftone images

text:
In article <[email]> [email] (Stan Reeves) writes:

I can't give an exhaustive summary, but can perhaps get you started.
I'll assume that you're referring to binary (monochrome) rather than
color halftoning.  There seems to be relatively more research activity
in the area of halftoning per se than there is in the area of
compression of halftoned images.  If you are interested in halftoning
by itself, see the Proceedings of the ICASSP-91, ICASSP-92, and
SPIE-92 conferences for some of the most recent proposed methods.  A
few (not all) of the relevant names are Neuhoff & Pappas, Zakhor, and
Allebach.  There is also Ulichney's book, _Digital Halftoning_, put
out by MIT Press (1987), which presents a variety of analyses on a
variety of halftoning techniques.

There are two forms of compression that you might be interested
in---lossless and lossy.  For lossless (noiseless, no information
loss) compression, the most promising method (in my opinion) is IBM's
Q-coder, which is documented by about five articles in the _IBM
Journal of Research and Development_, November, 1988 (Vol. 32, No. 6).
These articles have other useful references as well.  IBM is working
to have their system established as part of the Joint Binary Image
Group (JBIG) standard for compression.  It seems to be an excellent
noiseless coding scheme, which routinely produces coding rates that
achieve or beat the first-order entropy for a variety of halftoned
images.

For lossy compression, there have been a couple of published works in
which the halftoning and compression are done separately (Neuhoff &
Pappas, ICASSP-91; Y.-M. Chao, "An Investigation into the Coding of
Halftone Images," Ph.D. thesis, MIT, 1987).  I co-authored a paper at
ICASSP-92 showing that a better idea is to do the halftoning and
compression jointly.  In that paper, we showed an image compressed at
about 11:1 which looks pretty decent (we think!).  We are continuing
to work on this problem here at Stanford.  Hope this helps....

Rick A. Vander Kam
[email]


author: Reiner Eschbach

subject: Re: Compressing halftone images

text:
In article <[email]> [email] (Stan Reeves) writes:

Stan,
how do I have to read this? What is 'coding of halftone images', there are a
lot of different ways to read this. Since the title says 'compression', do you
want to know about the compression of halftones? Also there is a big
difference between a halftone you have just generated and want to
store/transmit/print and a halftone image you have just scanned from a paper
original.

Reiner


author: william E Davidsen

subject: Re: Compressing halftone images

text:
The only useful thing I've found with halftone is to convert with an
algorithm to greyscale, then JPEG them. Lossy as hell, but they are
small and look good.


author: Julian Scarfe

subject: Vacuum ultra-violet

text:
What range of frequencies (wavelengths or energies if you prefer) does the
range know as Vacuum Ultra-Violet cover (is there an official definition?),
and where does it get the name from?

Thanks

Julian Scarfe
[email]


author: John Moulder

subject: Re: Vacuum ultra-violet

text:
100 - 180 nm

I don't think this is official.  The "official" (CIE publication 17) name for
the region is UV-C which covers 100 - 280 nm

Fact:  frequencies below 180 nm are readily absrobed by air
Guess: I suspect that this designation was used because these frequencies
will only travel through a vacuum


subject: Vacuum ultra-violet (thanks)

text:
In article <jas12-290694145929@131.111.200.3>, [email] (Julian
Scarfe) wrote:

Thanks very much to those who replied to my question.

There was no real agreement on the wavelength range so I'll call it
"approximately 100 to 200 nm".  The name comes from the need to do
experiments in vacuo because this part of the spectrum is readily
attenuated by air.

Julian Scarfe
[email]


author: Douglas P. McNutt

subject: Re: Vacuum ultra-violet

text:
In Article <[email]>,
[email] (John Moulder) wrote:
Close, but not quite.
I did what was called "vacuum ultraviolet spectroscopy"
You have to put your entire spectrometer in a vacuum chanberr because air
absorbs the radiation.
Actually the work extended to what are called "soft" X-rays. The transition
is continuous.

Forgive the use of old units - Angstroms - 10e-8cm

There is a strong hydrogen line at 1013A which is about the shortest wavelength
which can be studied in air and the usable path is only a few centimeters.
Shorter than that is the vacuum UV. It corresponds to about 10 electron volts.
X-rays don't penetrate much air until several thousand volts.

Useful formula :  12345/angstroms = electron volts. It's really 12395.


author: AverageJoe

subject: z score calc / significance test

text:
Hi,
suppose the probability for a normal distributed event is 25%.
Someone achieves a hit rate of 34.46% (122 hits out of 354).
How significant is this result, ie. what is the z score for this result?
Is it z = 3.89 ?


author: Ray Koopman

subject: Re: z score calc / significance test

text:
On Aug 21, 3:47 am, AverageJoe <[email]> wrote:

If a variable is normally distributed then the probability of any
particular value is zero. Only intervals have a nonzero probability.
When do you mean by an event?


author: Stan Brown

subject: Re: z score calc / significance test

text:
Fri, 21 Aug 2009 12:47:00 +0200 from AverageJoe
<[email]>:

Standard error = sqrt( p * (1-p) / n)
               = sqrt( .25 * .75 / 354)
               = about .023

z = (phat - p) / standard error
  = (.3446-.25).023 = 4.54


subject: Re: z score calc / significance test

text:
Ray Koopman wrote:

Hi, it has been solved. See the other reply here,
and here for more details: http://groups.google.com/group/sci.math/browse_thread/thread/8d6547beb0443a8e


subject: Re: z score calc / significance test

text:
Stan Brown wrote:

Thx, the result of the above calc should be about 4.11 instead of 4.54 IMHO.
And, why did you call it "Standard error"? Shouldn't that be rather the "Standard deviation"?
The eq for the std error is StdErr = StdDev / sqrt(n)
according to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_error_(statistics)
Nevertheless it helped much, thx.


author: Bruce Weaver

subject: Re: z score calc / significance test

text:
AverageJoe wrote:

The standard error of a statistic *is* a standard deviation--it is
the standard deviation of the sampling distribution of that
statistic.

How you compute the SE depends on what the statistic is.  For
example, if the statistic is the sample mean, then SE = SD /
SQRT(n).  But if the statistic is the log of the odds ratio from a
2x2 table, SE = SQRT(1/a + 1/b + 1/c + 1/d).  And if the statistic
is the sample proportion (p), then the (large-sample) SE is given
by the formula Stan shows above.


subject: Re: z score calc / significance test

text:
Sat, 22 Aug 2009 11:44:38 +0200 from AverageJoe
<[email]>:

Yes, you're right.  I'm not sure how I got it wrong before.

Indeed it is, and that's the equation I used.  The standard deviation
of a binomial population is sqrt(p*(1-p)), and dividing by sqrt(n)
gives the computation I used.

But a standard error *is* a standard deviation: it's the standard
deviation of the distribution of sample proportions. In chapter 1 of
your textbook you should have learned about sampling error, the
phenomenon that different samples typically do not give the same
statistic.  (Of course sampling error is not an error or mistake,
just the name from the natural variability from one random sample to
the next. Sorry, I didn't create the terminology.)

The standard deviation of the sampling distribution of sample
proportions, or standard error of the proportion, is a yardstick for
the amount of variability to be expected in the sample proportion
phat of different samples.


subject: Re: z score calc / significance test

text:
Sat, 22 Aug 2009 22:09:01 -0400 from Stan Brown
<[email]>:

But at least I showed my work, so that you could see the method I
used and determine that I had made an arithmetic mistake. :-)


author: ed

subject: Autocad traverse question

text:
We use Autocad R-14 with Softdesk v8.x Survey.
We haven't been able to create a traverse loop without
manually typing in all the angles and distances.
  We were wondering if we already have cogo points
created in the drawing is there any way to assign these
points to a traverse definition ?? This would be very
handy for compass ruling large data dump traverse loops.


author: Gutek

subject: Re: Autocad traverse question

text:
Hi,

Such problems with AutoCAD you can solve with VisualLisp. It would take a
moment to write such a program, but I think it's worth to do it.

Gutek

ed <NoSpam@NoEmail> Napisal(a):


author: JT

subject: Re: Autocad traverse question

text:
Ed:
I saw the foregoing dialog in the Autodesk.Land-Desktop newsgroup:
Good luck!!

LDT


subject: Re: Autocad traverse question

text:
Could you send a link to Autodesk.Land-Desktop newsgroup ?

JT <[email]> Napisaï¿½(a):


author: Guy Gelinas

subject: Patient Tracking System

text:
I am writing a research paper on technology based solution for
hospitals to help patient tracking. Could you provide what system is
or is being implemented in which hospital.

Thank you

Guy


author: John Mill

subject: Re: Patient Tracking System

text:
I've heard there are fifteen hospitals using some new system that
downloads patient data to PDAs.  MercuryMD.  Apparently, the users
love it.  We're looking into them, too.

[email] (Guy Gelinas) wrote in message news:<[email]>...


author: Gene Harris

subject: Re: Patient Tracking System

text:
My wife's hospital just got set up with them and she showed me the
program a few days ago. She's a pharmacist and they spend a bunch of
time following up on labs and drug levels. She used to have to write
all the stuff down on a card to pass off to the next person covering
the service but now its all right there on the device. She actually
gets off shift when she's supposed to now instead of spending an extra
hour catching up on docuemntation. I've seen a lot of these programs.
She showed me the program a few days ago and it's like nothing I'd
seen. Looks like a video game.

[email] (John Mill) wrote in message news:<[email]>...


author: BAC

subject: ID request

text:
Greetings all,

Found this moth sitting on my car tonight. I've got most of my local
butterflies down, but I'm clueless about the moth side of the equation. If
anyone could ID it for me, I'd be most grateful!

Thanks in advance.

BAC


author: OscartheGrouch

subject: Re: ID request

text:
"BAC" <[email]> wrote in message
news:Xns997661C8E006BACSTER@199.45.49.11...

We'll need to see that photo. Post it somewhere then post a link to it.


subject: Re: ID request

text:
BAC <[email]> wrote in news:Xns997661C8E006BACSTER@199.45.49.11:

Okay, take 2...


subject: Re: ID request

text:
"OscartheGrouch" <[email]> wrote in
news:u8Xoi.10199$zy4.2474@trndny07:

[..]

Duh, sorry. It's late.


subject: Re: ID request

text:
"BAC" <[email]> wrote in message
news:Xns99765905866AFBACSTER@199.45.49.11...

The photo please.


subject: Re: ID request

text:
"OscartheGrouch" <[email]> wrote in news:Bhapi.10244
$zy4.3648@trndny07:

Yes, I suppose that would be useful... apologies.

http://www.mediafire.com/imageview.php?quickkey=8gwulbxn0mm&thumb=4

BAC


subject: Re: ID request

text:
"BAC" <[email]> wrote in message
news:Xns9976DDA1E9251BACSTER@199.45.49.11...

Oh, nice. I think it's a Eumorpha fasciata, Family Sphingidae, hawkmoths.
Somewhere in the southwest US?


subject: Re: ID request

text:
"OscartheGrouch" <[email]> wrote in
news:rRepi.5729$jC4.2174@trndny09:

Yes, College Station, Texas.

Interesting! May have to spend some more observation time outdoors at
night feeding the skeeter population... I didn't realize we had these
guys around here.

Thanks much!

http://www.mediafire.com/imageview.php?quickkey=4ybhe2mbwk1&thumb=5

BAC


author: Hugh McGuinness

subject: RE: ID request

text:
Would the person who posted the Eumorpha fasciata reply to the list or
me with the location and date of the record? I can't seem to find the
original post.

Hugh

Hugh McGuinness
The Ross School
18 Goodfriend Dr.
East Hampton, NY 11963
631-907-5229 (no messages)
631-697-2099 (cell)

-----Original Message-----
From: [email] [mailto:[email]]
On Behalf Of OscartheGrouch
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2007 12:03 AM
To: [email]
Subject: Re: ID request

"BAC" <[email]> wrote in message
news:Xns9976DDA1E9251BACSTER@199.45.49.11...
news:Xns997661C8E006BACSTER@199.45.49.11:
local

Oh, nice. I think it's a Eumorpha fasciata, Family Sphingidae,
hawkmoths.
Somewhere in the southwest US?

 ------------------------------------------------------------

   For subscription and related information about LEPS-L visit:

   http://www.peabody.yale.edu/other/lepsl

 ------------------------------------------------------------

   For subscription and related information about LEPS-L visit:

   http://www.peabody.yale.edu/other/lepsl


subject: Re: ID request

text:
"BAC" <[email]> wrote in message
news:Xns9976F2A4CA473BACSTER@199.45.49.11...

Get a black light, or better, a mercury vapor lamp, and I think you might be
amazed at the moths you have in Texas.


author: FoulAGWSludge

text:
The Nissan Leaf: Sort of like a real car, except it allegedly helps
prevent hurricanes, it's often powered by coal, it may take 12+ hours to
"refill", and it may not get you home if your return trip isn't all
downhill

Nissan's all-electric LEAF requires a mental
readjustment

But (and yes, there are a lot of buts with the LEAF), while the 75
mile range I had when I first received the full-charged car slowly
disappeared during urban, low-speed driving, it drastically evaporated
when I ran the car at 75 mpg down to Castle Rock.

  More annoyingly, the car's extremely comprehensive navigation and
interactivity system (your LEAF is a bit of a test vehicle and is
sending data back to Nissan as you drive) sent me to an empty cul-de-sac
as a listed recharging station, and I opted to take back roads and drive
slowly to get back to the hotel to charge the car.

  Alternately, you can use the supplied power cord to simply plug the
LEAF into a household 110-volt outlet, but it takes 21 hours to fully
charge. LEAF owners will have their garages wired for the same 240-volt
charger I found at the hotel, and this will recharge the car in about
seven hours. As mentioned, even three-plus hours on one of these
chargers only got me about a quarter of a virtual tank extra.

  http://tinyurl.com/3tfnq25


author: Hans

subject: Q:Saturn V launch movies.

text:
Happy Easter everyone.

I am giving a presentation next month, with the Apollo project as subject.
To make it all more "tastefull" I would like to use one or more Saturn V
launch movies, like one I've seen on TV. That was a slow-motion movie of the
launch of Apollo 10.
Is there a location on the internet where I can find this one or more of
this kind?. (I know Kipp Teague's Apollo Archive so I am looking for more)

Thanx


author: ianf

subject: Re: Q:Saturn V launch movies.

text:
Some mpeg clips here, no audio though.

http://spaceflight.nasa.gov/gallery/video/apollo/apollo11/html/launch.html

Cheers
Ian

"Hans" <[email]> wrote in message
news:c5ba95$bb1$[email]...
the


author: John Beaderstadt

subject: Re: Q:Saturn V launch movies.

text:
On Sun, 11 Apr 2004 13:23:01 +0200, "Hans"
<[email]> wrote:

Dunno about the net, but you should be able to find the DVD "To the
Moon" fairly easily,  It has a *great* S5 launch sequence.

--------------
Beady's Corollary to Occam's Razor:  "The likeliest explanation of any phenomenon is almost always the most boring one imaginable."

-----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
-----==  Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =-----


subject: Re: Q:Saturn V launch movies.

text:
So far many thanks to all, especially to you. But I can always use more, for
my own enjoyment too.
These movies only are worth my new 50 Euro's a month broadband internet
connection ;-)
Hans
www.project-apollo.info

"ianf" <[email]> schreef in bericht
news:c5db2s$2jl7$[email]...
subject.
more)


author: James G. Joyce

subject: Re: Q:Saturn V launch movies.

text:
"John Beaderstadt" <[email]> wrote in message
news:[email]...
more)
phenomenon is almost always the most boring one imaginable."

I'd also recommend "For All Mankind" for its Saturn V launch ... though you
might not want the dubbed-in astronaut comments ... "Yahoo!"

(Pretty darn impressive in Dolby Digital 5.1 surround ... and Al Reinart got
some GOOD images from the NASA archives ...)

James


author: Marc Verhaegen

subject: parasites & nakedness - still no no rebuttal of AAH

text:
The only academic attempt at a rebuttal is John Langdon's 'Umbrella
hypotheses and parsimony in human evolution: a critique of the aquatic ape
hypothesis' 1997 Journal of Human Evolution 33:479-494 which was an honest
attempt, but (in my view) deeply flawed.   A number of less academic efforts
have been made (see Jim Moore's website at
http://www.inforamp.net/~jimmoore/AAT/Opening-Darwin.html for the most
detailed if vitriolic example).  Personally, I think the best possible way
of refuting any form of AAH is for the professionals to come up with a
rational, coherent and internally consistent model of human evolution. One
of the main reasons why so many people see a case for AAH is because all the
non-aquatic explanations are so inadequate. The parasites research is a
classic case in point - published with a fanfare of trumpets in the academic
and popular press, and yet totally nonsensical to anyone with a grain of
common sense. The professionals really ought to be able to do better than
this.-- Pauline Ross


subject: Re: parasites & nakedness - still no no rebuttal of AAH

text:
Another problem with the "parasite load" theory is that they fail to explain
why our ancestors would favour hairlessness over the accepted primate method
of dealing with parasites, which is grooming. These grooming sessions are a
vital part of primate bonding and are at the core of their social
infrastructure. It is hard to believe that  we were (in some mysterious way)
so susceptible to parasites that we had to evolve a unique method of dealing
with them that no other primate has adopted. Where are these dreaded bugs?
Until they can explain a unique parasite load that would cause this trait to
evolve only in us, their hypothesis has to be rejected. It amazes me how
such a paper could ever be published. They must be desperate!    Bernie


author: Jenny

text:
Is there a site where this article exists on the webb? I would like to read
it.Could you post a link, maybe?
Jen


text:
"Jenny" <[email]> wrote in message
news:BvvKa.1722$[email]...

read it.Could you post a link, maybe? Jen

You mean the paper of M.Pagel & W.Bodmer "A naked ape would have fewer
parasites"? If you want, I'll send you the pdf. Please let me know your
email address.

Marc


author: MikeS

subject: Newbie question

text:
I just purchased a home built in 1960 that has a fuse box (not a
circuit-breaker type).  Is there a way to tell how much the supply current
to the house is by looking at the box (60 amp or 100 amp, etc.)?

Thanks!


author: Jerry Shelton

subject: Re: Newbie question

text:
In 1960? I'm  about 99.9% sure it is a 60 amp service
"MikeS" <[email]> wrote in message
news:[email]...


author: [redacted]

subject: Re: Newbie question

text:
There should be a Main pull-out unit, probly near the top of the panel.  If
it is approx 5-6 inches high (the pull-out part) it is 100 amp, if it is
only about 3.5-4" high, it is 60.

OR, turn off all the loads in the house and pull the Main...then read the
value of the main fuses, then put it back and turn your house back on, set
your clocks, etc.


author: Roy Q.T.

subject: Re: Newbie question

text:
The Voltage is the only thing constant in all Residential  Systems., The
Current Supplied varies with The Load (what is actually ON your system)
Do you want to make sure you have the right type service  conductors
inside your New house for 100 amps ? - Did you say it's 1960 Handyman
Special ?

 you probably don't

If you want to know how much current your Fuse Box (dead give away) is
supplying with all your Household Appliances and Light on,

Place an Ammeter on both your Hot leads before the Fuses in the (you
reall need to change it) Fuse Box and whatever they read together is
your supply.

Looking at your Feed wires in your Panel Box should give you an Ideam if
they look almost like the Branch Circuit wires coming out, you do not
(shouldn't) have 100 Amps there.

®oy


subject: Re: Newbie question

text:
Most boxes have a rating stamped somewhere on the box or the cover
(inside or out) or on the plastic housing holding the two main fuses as
described by another poster.  Using an ammeter will only tell you the
current draw at the time youare measuring it, it is hard to figure out
how you would get all branches to draw their maximum and get to just
below the fuse-blowing limit without maybe  going over.  Looking at the
main fuses is usually the best method because the holde is sized
correctly for the rest of the box, and main fuses are different sized
to prevent  the wrong fuses from being used.  Only possible problem
would be if the original wiring was not heavy enough to handle the main
fuse size, you didn't indicate how the original house was wired, by a
reputable source or someone who just threw things together without
proper knowledge or building inspection.

H. R.(Bob) Hofmann


subject: Re: Newbie question

text:
On Sat, 5 Mar 2005 11:57:19 -0500 [email] wrote:

|> Is there a way to tell how much the supply current to the house is by
|> looking at the box (60 amp or 100 amp, etc.)?
|
| There should be a Main pull-out unit, probly near the top of the panel.  If
| it is approx 5-6 inches high (the pull-out part) it is 100 amp, if it is
| only about 3.5-4" high, it is 60.
|
| OR, turn off all the loads in the house and pull the Main...then read the
| value of the main fuses, then put it back and turn your house back on, set
| your clocks, etc.

It could be a split-bus fuse box.  There could be as many as 6 pullouts
required to disconnect the power.  The house I grew up in, in the 1960's,
built in late 1940's, had a fuse box with 4 pullouts, 3 for 240 volt stuff
(stove, dryer, A/C) and 1 for the 8 plug fuses below it, for lights and
regular outlets.  I believe the amperages were 40, 40, 30, 30, so it would
have had to be well over 100 amps.  But a smaller box in a smaller house
could well be 60 amps with a couple pullouts and 4 plug fuses.

If I were buying a house, having an old fuse box in there would thrill me
for two reasons.  One would be for the project of putting in a breaker box.
The other would be for having an old antique.  If only I could get the fuse
box my great-grandfather had.  It had 2 cartridge clips for big fuses and
4 plug fuses in separate ceramic sockets, with everything open wired to
screw terminals.  There was no disconnect; the cartridge fuses had to be
pulled from live clips.  He had a little scissors gadget to do it.


author: Jay

subject: We can make stats say whatever we want

text:
Hi, can someone help me. I need to criticize the fallowing saying: "
We can make stats say whatever we want".

Thanks


author: Reef Fish

subject: Re: We can make stats say whatever we want

text:
[email] wrote:

If it were a troll, you would have fallen for it.

Unfortunately, it was a sad reality of sci.stat.math that you had spent
months here talking about statistical subjects of which you knew
absolutely nothing about, but pretended that you did.

But I have to admit that your noise level has been way down, lately.
You should have kept it that way.

-- Bob.


author: "Luis A. Afonso"

text:
Mathematical knowledge adds vigor to the minds, frees it from prejudice, credulity, and superstition.
-- John Arbuthnot

(wishful thinking...)

[email]


text:
Nice quote. I also like:

Therefore O students study mathematics and do not build without
foundations.
- Leonardo Da Vinci

Cheers,

Ross-c


text:
[email] wrote:

Now I FINALLY understood why you posted on so many subjects
without the slightest idea what those subjects are about, such
as principal components, eigenvalue-eigenvector analysis,
clustering and multidimensional methods, etc., to name a
few out of dozens.

You aspired for someone to mislabel you as someone who has
studied mathematics and change Da Vinci's "0" to "1", weren't you?

-- Bob.


text:
I've got better things to do with my life than to respond to trolls.

Cheers,

Ross-c


author: Eric Bohlman

text:
"Jay" <[email]> wrote in news:1124667514.928735.327210
@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:

The results of statistical analysis can be no better than the quality of
the assumptions and the quality of the data being analyzed.  You might want
to look up Richard Feynman's definition of "cargo-cult science" in which
extremely sophisticated statistical procedures are used in an attempt to
squeeze blood out of a turnip.


text:
Eric Bohlman wrote:

Why would anyone need to look up Feynman's definition or any
sophisticated
procedures to see any "attempt to squeeze blood out of a turnip"?

All you need to do is look at the books, papers, and even discussions
in this very newsgroup to see the attempts of pseudo scientists
attempting to squeeze blood out of WHITE POTATOES, in their causal
conclusions from uncontrolled, observational studies on correlations.
:-)

-- Bob.


author: Paul Sanchez

text:
In article <[email]>,
 "Jay" <[email]> wrote:

You can help yourself by grabbing a copy of "How to Lie With Statistics"
(Link to Amazon: <http://tinyurl.com/7fh9q>).  The book was written in
1954, and it shows, but that is part of its charm as it tells you how
faulty logic, poor methodology, and misunderstandings about the
difference between correlation and causality can cause people to be led
astray.  It's a good primer on what to guard against to avoid common
mistakes or being misled by people who would use the title literally.

--paul


text:
Jay wrote:

LOL!    Iit iees true, senor.

"But only the extremely gullible and ill-educated, like SOME regulars
 in sci.stat.math, would buy it."   :-)

-- Bob.


author: Jerry Dallal

text:
Jay wrote:
You can make *anything* say whatever you want.  However, the more
outrageous the statement and the contortions it takes to get to it, the
less likely it is to hold up under scrutiny.  Anything else that might
be said will just be variations on this theme.


text:
Ronald Bruck wrote:

I didn't know that!

http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionary&va=gullible

And even if it weren't in YOUR dictionary, you knew what it meant,
didn't you?   ;^)

-- Bob.


text:
Ronald Bruck wrote:

I thought I knew all the ancient jokes.  I guess I missed that one.
Is La Cucaracha Guchi-Cuchi Charro's deceased husband?

-- Bob.


text:
Sometimes I get the impression that it's not a case that with
sufficient effort, statistics can be made to lie. Sometimes I feel that
simple and straightforward statistics more or less lie by default and
it requires significant effort and great care to stop them lying.
Perhaps this is biased by my experience with machine learning where
simple and "obvious" (to the unitiated) methods of testing the
performance of a machine learning algorithm will grossly overestimate
accuracy. But even more sophisticated methods such as various forms of
cross-validation still have their own biases which need to be taken
into account when considering estimates of accuracy. The same applies
to medicine, where if placebo effects, experimentor effects, and the
like are not considered then statistical analyses of the resulting
faulty data can easily promote inaccurate conclusions.

I don't mean this as a criticism of statistics as a field nor to
criticise individual techniques. But I would like to follow up Jerry's
comment by saying that statistics can easily "lie" due to the absence
of contortions, rather than the presence thereof.

Cheers,

Ross-c


text:
Jay wrote:

I generally agree with the previous respondents.  I would say that
statistics can be used (properly) or abused or distorted to make
rhetorical points.  In that respect statistics is no different
than some other ways of making rhetorical points.  But because
statistics are quantitative they appear to provide objective facts
(of course, in some cases they actually do provide objective facts)
which sometimes leads them to be perceived as more certain than
qualitative statements.  That makes statistics a powerful tool to
use or abuse.  The fact that the ways in which statistics can be
abused or distorted are not commonly known among the (unfortunately)
large fraction of the population that are rather ignorant of the
subject increases the potential for abuse.  However, eventually the
disconnect between reality and what the statistical abusers say
becomes apparent to people even if they can not put their fingers
on exactly what the source of the disconnect is.  This gives
statistics as a discipline a bad name (lies, damned lies, and
statistics).

Cheers,
Russell


text:
Jerry Dallal wrote:

Speaking of dictionaries, I am the proud possessor of a 537-page
"Dinkum Dictionary" for Aussie English.  You won't find the word
"gullible" there, but you can find about 75 SYNONYMS for the male
organ and about 40 for the female one.

You probably didn't know that "cake-hole, chops, gob, kisser,
laughing-gear, moosh, rattle-trap ..." are all synonyms for the
mouth.

The Aussies put statisticians to shame in the OP's subject.  :)

-- Bob.


author: Ronald Bruck

text:
In article <[email]>,
Reef Fish <[email]> wrote:

Did you know that the word "gullible" isn't even in the dictionary?

:-)

--Ron Bruck


text:
In article <[email]>,
Reef Fish <[email]> wrote:

This is an ancient joke.  I saw it most recently in the comic strip "La
Cucaracha".

--Ron Bruck


text:
Reef Fish wrote:

I have an American Heritage Dictionary that was printed with a missing
folio in the 'm's.  So, I get to say weird things, like, "Did you know
that 'xxx' isn't in the dictionary?" where xxx would have been in the
folio...like "mother".  Then, when my statement is contested, I get to
hand the other party the dictionary and challenge him/her to prove me wrong.


text:
[email] wrote:

Not to get into a protracted debate over something where we are probably
in agreement, but by "contortions" I meant whatever it takes to to make
it seem like truth. Sometimes the absence of "contortions" *is* the
contortion, because it's a contortion insofar as doing justice to the
data.  Perhaps it would have been better had I left the word out
entirely and merely typed

"You can make *anything* say whatever you want.  However, the more
outrageous the statement, the less likely it is to hold up under
scrutiny.  Anything else that might be said will just be variations on
this theme."


text:
"Jerry Dallal" <[email]> wrote in message
news:QTnOe.982$[email]...

There's some interesting stuff on the misuse of statistics starting at:

 http://www.junkscience.com/JSJ_Course/jsjudocourse/11.htm

Click the forward arrow at the bottom of the page; there are several pages
on the misuse of statistics.

Paul


author: Bruce Weaver

text:
Pavel314 wrote:

Some of those pages look good.  But then I got to this one, which
miscalculates the relative risk:

   http://www.junkscience.com/JSJ_Course/jsjudocourse/13.htm


text:
"Bruce Weaver" <[email]> wrote in message
news:1126183520.7cf9daf5e825cbc53ab77aea7cf74621@teranews...

You should send them the correct calculation; they'd probably appreciate it.

Paul


text:
Pavel314 wrote:

I did, but first had to spend some time hunting for an e-mail address.


author: The Slash

subject: Wireless USB adapter with broken plug

text:
I have this wireless USB adapter with a broken plug. Specifically, two
of the contact points for the plug have become unsoldered. I have
kludged my way past this problem in the past by using bits of tin foil
to complete the circuit where the contacts where broken (don't laugh!),
but for whatever reason, that doesn't seem to be working anymore. The
power led for the device will light up just fine, but the link light
will only light for a second, then go dim (in the best case scenario;
sometimes it doesn't light up at all), and whenever I do a `lsusb`
(Linux command to determine the bus ids plugged in usb devices) it
isn't detected. Hotplug doesn't seem to find it either. If I move the
plug around, I can get the leds to light up or dim though, depending on
how I move it, although sometimes doing this causes kernel panics. I
just thought that fact would be useful so that you all know how *I*
know how the broken contact points are truly the problem. Needless to
say, it's wireless networking capabilities remain, for the time being,
null. Any ideas would be greatly appreciated. :)

PS: Sorry for the double post (if you even noticed it); Somehow when I
posted earlier it got listed as an 'active older topic' (o_0;) , so I
posted it again.


author: Art

subject: Re: Wireless USB adapter with broken plug

text:
Need either to open the thing physically up and do some actual diagnostics
or go purchase another one. The tinfoil routine may have done more damage
than good, especially if any debris has found it's way deeper into the
product. Remove the case, use a magnifying glass to physically look at the
connections you are referring to, see if any of the circuit traces are
physically broken or if maybe only the solder connections have come loose.
If you are adept at soldering then have at it, otherwise another exercise in
fustration.
"The Slash" <[email]> wrote in message
news:[email]...


text:
Art wrote:

Yeah, the connection from the actual plug to the rest of the device is
broken, so it only has power when I move it a certain way.


author: kelly

subject: When to do blood test for Lyme?

text:
I need the advice of you experts. You are an invaluable source! EM
rash seen on 6th September, went to doctors 7th September, started
doxycycline for 3 week course.  Doctor said to wait 1-2 weeks for
blood test (since antibodies may not have formed?).  Well, here it is
2 weeks and 5 days since rash.  Is now a good time?  I just don't want
to waste the trip to get stuck for blood, and it still be too early
for testing.   Thanks so much!!!


author: AramSarah

subject: Re: When to do blood test for Lyme?

text:
If you have a physician diagnosed EM rash then you have Lyme disease no matter
what any blood test says.  An EM rash is diagnostic of Lyme disease by itself.
Best wishes,
Sarah


author: Connie White

subject: Re: When to do blood test for Lyme?

text:
I had an EM rash and was treated with doxy for 3 weeks just like you.
Several months later, started going downhill, and by 6 months post
bites was nearly bedridden with Lyme symptoms.  Didn't make the connection
with Lyme until a year after bites, and then tested negative.  Doc started doxy
 again with a clinical dx, and I improved some, but never really got well.
Relapsed in a bad way 2 1/2 years after bites, this time with neurological
symptoms
on top of all the flu-like stuff.  I have NEVER tested positive, but am
receiving
appropriate treatment with a clinical dx when I finally found a doc who knows
what he is doing.  And the best part is that after 7 months of treatment,
 I am getting well, and feel better than I have in 3 years.  Don't let the
docs tell you that you do not have Lyme.  The EM rash means you do.  Take
this seriously and hopefully you will avoid going through the
nightmare I have been through.  If you need a LLMD, put out a post
which indicates where you are located.   Also check on Lymenet for a support
group in your area.  They also have a "seeking a doc" section on there where
you can post.

Good luck!!

"kelly" <[email]> wrote in message
news:[email]...


author: Glen Overby

subject: Re: Human vs. Robot Explorers!   An Easy Debate to Win!

text:
Fred J. McCall  <[email]> wrote:

That was a very slanted comparison.  The rover stopped and made observations
every single day, and spent many days making observations instead of
traveling.  A human exploring along the same route would also stop to make
observations.

Why do the proponents of human exploration always want to destroy robotic
exploration?

Glen Overby


author: Greg D. Moore (Strider

text:
"Glen Overby" <[email]> wrote in message
news:[email]...

It also stopped due to dust storms, low light levels and simply to plot
course.

Humans wouldn't be stopping nearly as often or for as long.

Why are so many people bent on making it an either/or proposition.  Both
have their place.


author: Pat Flannery

text:
Glen Overby wrote:

Because that's not the way it was done in the science fiction they read,
or the science fiction movies they saw, as kids.
Ever notice how many sci-fi fans are politically conservative?
Liberals look forward to a future utopia that will never be;
conservatives look back to a golden age that never was.
They want the future to be the way they remember it.

Pat